Disc Brake Questions

[dbasteve]

If anyone has any questions about brakes feel free to post here.

Rotors
Callipers
Pads
Street
Racing
Upgrades



I don't sell em, I just make them. ( rotors only)

[[SPESHAL]]

I just bought some DBA slotted front rotors, I aint got em yet though.
Will I notice any change in pedal feel or stopping distance?
Any info would be appreciated.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by [SPESHAL]
I just bought some DBA slotted front rotors, I aint got em yet though.
Will I notice any change in pedal feel or stopping distance?
Any info would be appreciated.

The slotted rotors will increase bite and help reduce fade under heavy braking.
They will pull you up quicker and you will feel the slots working on the pads. Depending on the hardness of the pad you may hear a little humming noise under heavy braking. That's the slots and it is normal.

[hotgemini]

DBA no longer have the full catalogue available on the website (in a single PDF), this has meant that I have had to look for options for brake upgrades using an outdated version of the full catalogue I already have... which is less than ideal, this angers me, in fact it downright pisses me off... Bendix have done the same f#cking thing with their catalogue which meant it took me two hours to do a 10 minute job, not happy.

Anyhow, just looking for a few details, can you get me full dimensions of a R32 skyline GTR (non-brembo) brake rotor, I mean more details than are included on the catalogue, thickness at the mounting face to the hub, internal diameter of the friction area... etc etc etc...

[dk]

Hi Steve

Can you tell me when the DBA 5000 two piece slotted rotors will be available for the TT Supra? I'd like to upgrade the brakes on my Soarer to run the Supra 4-piston calipers and those rotors look like they'll be exactly what I'm after.

dk

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Hotgemini
DBA no longer have the full catalogue available on the website (in a single PDF), this has meant that I have had to look for options for brake upgrades using an outdated version of the full catalogue I already have... which is less than ideal, this angers me, in fact it downright pisses me off... Bendix have done the same f#cking thing with their catalogue which meant it took me two hours to do a 10 minute job, not happy.

Anyhow, just looking for a few details, can you get me full dimensions of a R32 skyline GTR (non-brembo) brake rotor, I mean more details than are included on the catalogue, thickness at the mounting face to the hub, internal diameter of the friction area... etc etc etc...

Your right! This sucks.
Send me a PM or email with your email address and I will send a copy in PDF until it's fixed.
We have added quite a lot of Skylines this year.

The website is being rebuilt. If anyone has complaints or suggestions post it here and we will fix it.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by dk
Hi Steve

Can you tell me when the DBA 5000 two piece slotted rotors will be available for the TT Supra? I'd like to upgrade the brakes on my Soarer to run the Supra 4-piston calipers and those rotors look like they'll be exactly what I'm after.

dk

It's on the list already.
I have to finish the STi WRX first and them we move on to the Supra and Skyline. Same rotor but different mounting bell.
It will be about 3 months before they're finished for sale.

[gti6]

DBA don't make rotors for my 306 GTi-6! :(

And your sales rep told me to buy some standard ones. Nice try, I'm getting the EBC sports jobbies instead. ;)

Thought I'd post this for you, because the 306 rotors are known as a weak point, and are commonly replaced as they warp very quickly with any decent pad.

I have a friend on these forums who went through 3 sets during his warranty period...

Cheers,
Adrian

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by gti6
DBA don't make rotors for my 306 GTi-6! :(

And your sales rep told me to buy some standard ones. Nice try, I'm getting the EBC sports jobbies instead. ;)

Thought I'd post this for you, because the 306 rotors are known as a weak point, and are commonly replaced as they warp very quickly with any decent pad.

I have a friend on these forums who went through 3 sets during his warranty period...

Cheers,
Adrian

Peugeot's looking pretty lost and forgotten in the catalogue isn't it?
I'll pass the message on.
This is good feed back. Thanks!

[gti6]

Cheers Steve

You can have one of my warped ones if you like, so you've got something to work on... (just make sure you engineer the warps out :) )

[hotgemini]

There is another little thing you should/could do GTI6, get onto aussiefrogs and start spreading the word that if there is demand DBA might make some rotors... If you can create a groundswell of support, then magic can happen.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Hotgemini
There is another little thing you should/could do GTI6, get onto aussiefrogs and start spreading the word that if there is demand DBA might make some rotors... If you can create a groundswell of support, then magic can happen.

This is TRUE,

" The squeaky wheel gets the oil "

[hotgemini]

Which explains why I get so much oil then...

[Forg]

OK, here's one ... is it possible that the metal in the "hat" of my new DBA discs isn't as thick as the original Volvo ones? Sorry I dunno the proper term for it, I mean the surface that mounts to the hub.

The reason I ask is that the new Simmons wheels fouled the inside of the calipers; the part of the wheel that is squeezed up against this "hat" part of the rotor was hitting the innermost part of the caliper. I was rather cranky with Simmons themselves, and they're allegedly going to machine it so it fits ... but I wonder now if the reason it happened (and we're only talking mm of difference here) was because the DBA disc wasn't made of metal that's quite as thick as the original?

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Forg
OK, here's one ... is it possible that the metal in the "hat" of my new DBA discs isn't as thick as the original Volvo ones? Sorry I dunno the proper term for it, I mean the surface that mounts to the hub.

The reason I ask is that the new Simmons wheels fouled the inside of the calipers; the part of the wheel that is squeezed up against this "hat" part of the rotor was hitting the innermost part of the caliper. I was rather cranky with Simmons themselves, and they're allegedly going to machine it so it fits ... but I wonder now if the reason it happened (and we're only talking mm of difference here) was because the DBA disc wasn't made of metal that's quite as thick as the original?

The tolerance on the flange thickness is generally +/- 0.1mm on most discs. The only exception is some Chrysler discs that originaly had pressed steel hats. We increased this thickness when we redesigned our disc.
Callipers should clear the wheel by at least 3 to 5 mm to allow for any movement. The calliper is fixed to the upright and the rotor/wheel runs on wheel bearings that can wear out.

[gti6]

Hotgemini - I'm a member of Aussiefrogs, will spread the word...

I'm starting this off by giving Steve one rotor, hell, they might even have something similar already to suit - although that would be a miracle. Hmmm.. actually... no chance - the PCD is 108mm.

Cheers,
Adrian

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by gti6
Hotgemini - I'm a member of Aussiefrogs, will spread the word...

I'm starting this off by giving Steve one rotor, hell, they might even have something similar already to suit - although that would be a miracle. Hmmm.. actually... no chance - the PCD is 108mm.

Cheers,
Adrian

I have over 1000 babies to choose from. There must be something close.

108mm :wtf: bloody frogs!

See what we can do.

[gti6]

Tell me about it Steve, tell me about it....

Can you imagine the absolutely diverse selection of wheels available for our cars?

[Grumpy Rooster]

And here's another angry GTi6 owner.

I'm sure we will need new rotors soon, so was hoping that DBA would have some slotted rotors available by the time we needed them.....;)

[Forg]

Originally posted by gti6
Tell me about it Steve, tell me about it....

Can you imagine the absolutely diverse selection of wheels available for our cars?
This is the reason I've ordered Simmons wheels for the Volvo ... the only two other locally-available styles are both pig-ugly (and in a different way to the Volvo's ugliness, so they had no hope!).

And as you've no-doubt discovered, import duties, freight costs & the AUD->USD conversion rate makes for decent-priced wheels in the USA becoming way too exxy by the time they arrive. I was seriously thinking of some Borbet Type-E's, but forget it if they're going to be w/out warranty & cost more than the Simmons ...

[gtst4]

Steve,

Some time ago (it was around October LAST YEAR), I got some slotted rotors for my R32 GTS4. There was a note in the box that seemed to relate to the 'gold' disks, which mine weren't. So I emailed the sales team (I think it was them) to clarify if the same info was applicable. All I got was the 'automated response, we'll get back to you' email. After a few weeks of nothing from a real person, I emailed again, and again got the 'automated response, we'll get back to you' email, but nothing from a real person.

This is very poor service. From anyone.

Regards.

PS its no point getting them to respond, I'm sure the rotors are out of warranty by now, and, anyway, I'm going to try them out on The Island this Sunday.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by gtst4
Steve,

Some time ago (it was around October LAST YEAR), I got some slotted rotors for my R32 GTS4. There was a note in the box that seemed to relate to the 'gold' disks, which mine weren't. So I emailed the sales team (I think it was them) to clarify if the same info was applicable. All I got was the 'automated response, we'll get back to you' email. After a few weeks of nothing from a real person, I emailed again, and again got the 'automated response, we'll get back to you' email, but nothing from a real person.

This is very poor service. From anyone.

Regards.

PS its no point getting them to respond, I'm sure the rotors are out of warranty by now, and, anyway, I'm going to try them out on The Island this Sunday.

Well !
I can't comment for the sales people.
Apparently either can they :mad:

I work in Engineering and have nothing to sell.
What I can do is help people get the best out their brakes

Obviously there is a need for some quality support.

Fire away!

[RANDY]

Mate. I think your support here is excellent! To take time out to answer people's questions shows some real dedication to the brand.

Good work mate. =-]

(ps... i have no problems with my DBA's... the vibrating under load question was answered towards the top of the thread =-] )

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by RANDY
Mate. I think your support here is excellent! To take time out to answer people's questions shows some real dedication to the brand.

Good work mate. =-]

(ps... i have no problems with my DBA's... the vibrating under load question was answered towards the top of the thread =-] )

Your Welcome..:)

This forum appears to have a good mixture of applications which is excellent for everyone.

I think we will pitch a tent here and stay.

[mopar lover]

Steve,

I was lookong at a set of DBA slotted rotors for my VJ Valiant and only found one part number for all Valiants. It was #202, but there are two different rotor thicknesses for Valiants. What is the thickness for the rotors??

Also do your rotors come with hubs and wheel studs??

Is there any difference between the slotted and cross-drilled rotors? I have read that cross drilling can instigate stress-cracks. A few EA Ford saloon car racers had their x-drilled brakes almost fall to bits on them. Admitedly DBA said they would look into improving them even though they are not designed for racing purposes and they replaced all the failed discs for free.

Thanks, and keep up the good support!

[dbasteve]

Oh no! Valiant.
We've had some size issues regarding the Valiant and the different calipers used. Girling - Kelsey Hayes. Some cars have had calipers swapped over and all sorts of things that make life difficult.

Anyway I have a 24mm (VJ) and a 25.4mm (CL) thick rotor listed
both are 282mm diameter. I am aware that some workshops machine down the diameter to suit a VG, VH. which is 277.3mm.
Please note I am no expert on Valiants but this is the info I have.

As for slotted or cross drilled; Cross drilling is considered to be a street performance upgrade and not for track use.
Slotted is more suited for track or street cars with large power enhancements.
The less material mass (weight) in a cross drilled rotor will generate more heat than slotted or plain. Combined with high friction pads and tyres on a track, the heat load is above the recommended operating temperature for iron (650 C) and fatigue is accelerated.
This is why slotted rotors are used V8 supercars,saloon car, Rally cars, ect.

[FatBoy]

Steve,

Hopefully you can offer somer advice to me, seeing as your doing it well for all the other guys !! :)

I run an Improved Production RX-7 circuit car.
What brakes would you recommend ??
Do you know much about available calipers etc as well ??

As a guide at the moment it has commodore discs with volvo calipers on the front and stock s2 rx7 rears...

Any thoughts on a good upgrade for racing ??

Thanks,
Paul... ;)

[dbasteve]

If you can fit a VT size rotor in your wheels ( 15" ) we make heat treated flat type rotors that can be mounted on Aluminium hats for this type of application.
Combine this with an AP Racing 6 piston caliper CP5570 and you will have a stable, low fade, race quality setup.

We make these discs for WRX rally and track cars and they can handle anything you can throw at them.

http://www.dba.com.au/forum/5000_b1.jpg

[dbasteve]

http://www.dba.com.au/forum/CP5570.jpg

[Rads63]

I know that this may not be your area, but do you know where I can get hold of a set of longer wheel studs for a commodore (m12 x1.25 if im not mistaken ) as I really dont want to drill out my hubs and go with 1/2" studs and nuts ect.
If you could point me in the right direction it would be a real plus.
Cheers

[FatBoy]

dba-steve: They look absolutely awesome !! Would they fit my car, and how much approx would i be looking at ??

Some other info you may need...

* Car weight is approx 1050 kgs
* Currently runs 15 x 7" B45 Simmons wheels. (15's are the largest diameter wheel allowed for my type of car... ;) )

The stuff i have now works ok, but other cars with big brake set ups are all over me under brakes... i need better ones !! :p

Thanks for your assistance so far,
Paul... :)

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Rads63
I know that this may not be your area, but do you know where I can get hold of a set of longer wheel studs for a commodore (m12 x1.25 if im not mistaken ) as I really dont want to drill out my hubs and go with 1/2" studs and nuts ect.
If you could point me in the right direction it would be a real plus.
Cheers

It is out of my area, but I know a lot of people who can help.
I will ask the question and let you know.

[Group3JDatsun]

Originally posted by dbasteve


The slotted rotors will increase bite and help reduce fade under heavy braking.
They will pull you up quicker and you will feel the slots working on the pads. Depending on the hardness of the pad you may hear a little humming noise under heavy braking. That's the slots and it is normal.

Steve,

First to add to what the other guy's are saying, it's sensational to have you here.

I'm running an Improved Production Racing Datsun 1600 and I'm wondering how slotted rotors give better bite and help reduce fade? I was considering them when I did my brake conversion, but they weren't available in the SAAB rotors at the time. I'd heard many rumours/opinions on how/why they worked, but no-one I spoke to could give me something substancial. So.......could you please give me an explanation as to how it is that they offer the benefits you mentioned over normal rotors? :) Also could you make the explanation nice and slow too please - I'm just coming off night shift and I won't be sharp for a couple of days yet. :D :D :D

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by FatBoy
dba-steve: They look absolutely awesome !! Would they fit my car, and how much approx would i be looking at ??

Some other info you may need...

* Car weight is approx 1050 kgs
* Currently runs 15 x 7" B45 Simmons wheels. (15's are the largest diameter wheel allowed for my type of car... ;) )

The stuff i have now works ok, but other cars with big brake set ups are all over me under brakes... i need better ones !! :p

Thanks for your assistance so far,
Paul... :)

For 1050kg these are ideal!

Those rotors are fitted in 15" Subaru wheels. You may have to do a bit of homework for the fitting. One advantage of this type of system is that you can have hats made up to suit the offset you require to clear the caliper and upright.
The rotors in the pic are production items and retail for around $400 to $450 ea but the replacement rotors are about $180 to $200 . Reuse the hats
The Calipers are top of the range so expect about $900 ea. There are other less expensive versions, but not in 6 piston.

Please understand that I can't design a brake kit for each individuals car, but I am happy to give you all the info you need to do it yourself. Or I can forward you onto a workshop that does this on a regular basis.

P.S Those prices are guestimates but should be within $50 or so.

If your in Sydney you can organise to come in and have a look at these bits. I have a good range of calipers too. Not for sale, I use them to check dimensions.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Group3JDatsun


Steve,

First to add to what the other guy's are saying, it's sensational to have you here.

I'm running an Improved Production Racing Datsun 1600 and I'm wondering how slotted rotors give better bite and help reduce fade? I was considering them when I did my brake conversion, but they weren't available in the SAAB rotors at the time. I'd heard many rumours/opinions on how/why they worked, but no-one I spoke to could give me something substancial. So.......could you please give me an explanation as to how it is that they offer the benefits you mentioned over normal rotors? :) Also could you make the explanation nice and slow too please - I'm just coming off night shift and I won't be sharp for a couple of days yet. :D :D :D

Slotted rotors are designed to remove the dust caused by the friction process of braking. Also to reduce pad fade when running at higher temperatures.
By reducing dust and fade you will reduce glazing of the pad which will reduce temperatures and so on.

To cut a long story short.
Result= Better braking by maintaining optimum friction coefficient and less fatigue by reducing temperatures.

Here's a picture of two track rotors; one slotted and one standard. You can see the result of higher temps and the onset of fatigue.

http://www.dba.com.au/forum/slotted&standard.jpg

[Group3JDatsun]

Ok, so the slots effectively "clean" the surface of the pad, by the edge/corner of the slot scrapping/removing the (loose) dust. Is that correct? Does this mean that the advantage is reduced when using a harder pad (less dust)? Is the reduction of dust effectively the removal of an insulating layer allowing better heat transfer between the pad and rotor - is this what you mean by them reducing fade? Or is there another way in which they reduce fade?

That rotor on the right looks alot like my old front rotors, but alot less blue. :) Glad to have moved on from that brake setup....

Incidentally, damn you're up early......:)

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Group3JDatsun
Ok, so the slots effectively "clean" the surface of the pad, by removing the (loose) dust. Is that correct?
Yes.

[i] Does this mean that the advantage is reduced when using a harder pad (less dust)? [/B]No. The harder pad is to balance out wear from rotor to the pad. You wear the rotor a bit more to save on pad life.

[i] Is the reduction of dust effectively the removal of an insulating layer allowing better heat transfer between the pad and rotor, is this what you mean by them reducing fade? Or is there another way in which they reduce fade?[/B]Yes.

[i] That rotor on the right looks alot like my old front rotors, but alot less blue. :) [/B]
That rotor has been up to 800 + deg C (not good)

[Group3JDatsun]

Originally posted by dbasteve
No. The harder pad is to balance out wear from rotor to the pad. You wear the rotor a bit more to save on pad life.

This is bending my mind somewhat......probably not the best time for me to be trying to grasp this stuff. :) Oh well, you've got to take these opportunites when they come around. :D
I would have thought that it wasn't about wear but heat disapation/tolerance. As in more metal in the pad = great tolerance to heat, therefore no fade....or is that wrong.....


Yes.


That rotor has been up to 800 + deg C (not good) [/B]

Ahhhhh...yeah, they kinda glowed. Wheels were in excess of 100 degrees C (water = sizzle). They were solid rotors with much larger than standard calipers. Was quite surprised the pads stood up to it and didn't fade....ever. It did eat them (pads) damn fast though. Still, impressive work by the pad manufacturer IMHO. Anyhow, that's the reason I've gone to a bigger arrangement. :)

[dbasteve]

There is basically two types of pad for racing. The harder Ferro Carbon ( metal + carbon) and the Carbon Kevlar ( carbon, Kevlar,copper) which is more compressable.

Ferro Carbon pads use brute force ( friction ) to slow down and more metal gives a better pedal feel. Less pad wear, more rotor wear.

Carbon Kevlar pads use adhesion technology (sticky) to slow you down and have a spongy feel. More pad wear, less rotor wear

Both these pad types have compounds for high temperature resistance. Both can fade in race conditions.

It realy depends on your application and in most cases driving style/preference.

[Group3JDatsun]

I see, so that explains the cost of Carbon Metallic pads for example. Big dollars for big $$ tech. I'm using Pagid's.....and going by the price I'm assuming they're Ferro Carbon. Cool Carbon was like twice the price.......

Incidentally, what's the advantage of Carbon/Carbon brakes? I have the impression that it's got to do with higher temp's but I could well be way off.....

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Group3JDatsun
I see, so that explains the cost of Carbon Metallic pads for example. Big dollars for big $$ tech. I'm using Pagid's.....and going by the price I'm assuming they're Ferro Carbon. Cool Carbon was like twice the price.......

Incidentally, what's the advantage of Carbon/Carbon brakes? I have the impression that it's got to do with higher temp's but I could well be way off.....

Carbon pads and carbon rotors are mainly for formula 1 where the temperatures are beyond the limitations of cast iron. Carbon rotors are very stable and have a low expansion rate. It also allow the cars to use smaller diameter brakes which = smaller wheels and lower centre of gravity. Lower centre of gravity = better wind resistance less inertia when cornering ect ect ect.

Oh yeh! They cost sh*t loads of money too. $4000 + per corner.

Pagid's are more into adhesion technology and are very good. Another good pad is Ferodo DS3000. Very similar to pagid Blue but can handle a bit more heat.

[gtst4]

steve,

I'm running Phillip Island on Sunday. I have DBA slotted rotors (908s from memory) on my R32 GTS4, and Bendix Ultimate pads. Is this combination up to the task?

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by gtst4
steve,

I'm running Phillip Island on Sunday. I have DBA slotted rotors (908s from memory) on my R32 GTS4, and Bendix Ultimate pads. Is this combination up to the task?

The Ultimate would be good to drive to the track.....;) and then change to a Pagid Blue RS-42, Ferodo DS2500, Ferodo DS3000, EBC Blue, or Mintex 1155.

The Ultimates are a good street pad but don't handle track use very well.

[AzzurrA]

dbasteve

I would just like to say thanks for joining our little community, and offering your expertise in this field...

My question is what sort of rotors and calipers could i use on the front of my VK Commodore Wagon? I REALLY dislike my standard factory vented ones, as they dont seem to do their job overly well, as i like to corner etc, and use the brakes a fair bit....

I'm running 15" rims, and would like something in slotted... I would like it to be just bolt-in... what sort of prices would i be looking at? (i don't want to spend overly much, as its just a daily driver, so nothing over the top like AP 6-piston calipers;) )

Also, will putting better rotors/calipers on the front stuff up my braking? (as i'm still using the standard drum brakes on the rear)

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by ToranaFan
dbasteve

I would just like to say thanks for joining our little community, and offering your expertise in this field...

My question is what sort of rotors and calipers could i use on the front of my VK Commodore Wagon? I REALLY dislike my standard factory vented ones, as they dont seem to do their job overly well, as i like to corner etc, and use the brakes a fair bit....

I'm running 15" rims, and would like something in slotted... I would like it to be just bolt-in... what sort of prices would i be looking at? (i don't want to spend overly much, as its just a daily driver, so nothing over the top like AP 6-piston calipers;) )

Also, will putting better rotors/calipers on the front stuff up my braking? (as i'm still using the standard drum brakes on the rear)

The easiest upgrade is to change to VL/VN rotors 290mm dia instead of 270mm. What you need to do is buy the caliper bracket off a VL/VN which will be marked with an "L" in the casting for "Large" rotor.
This all bolts straight on without any mods.
We have done it quite a few times with utes to increase brake torque when carrying a load.

The larger disc is a DBA 017.

[gtst4]

Originally posted by dbasteve


The Ultimate would be good to drive to the track.....;) and then change to a Pagid Blue RS-42, Ferodo DS2500, Ferodo DS3000, EBC Blue, or Mintex 1155.

The Ultimates are a good street pad but don't handle track use very well. So, the discs are definitley up to it (despite the warning in the packaging about use in motorsport)?

Frankly, I've not had much problem with the Ultimates. Why do you recommend using a different pad in competition? But then again, maybe you can't have too much braking power.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by gtst4
So, the discs are definitley up to it (despite the warning in the packaging about use in motorsport)?

Frankly, I've not had much problem with the Ultimates. Why do you recommend using a different pad in competition? But then again, maybe you can't have too much braking power.

Bad experiences with Subaru's on the track. The ultimates will harden up as the resin drains out from being over temperature ( fade). This generates more heat into the disc and increases fatigue.

There are quite a few size differences between the two discs so it may not be a problem, but I'm being cautious.
If you have used ultimates on the track before with no issues then there's probably nothing to worry about. Just keep an eye on the outer trailing edges of the pad. If they start breaking away in large peices change them.

I can not endorse this product for motorsport.

This disc is designed as a high performance product.
I am just sharing some experiences....;)

[T-BONE]

dbasteve, what is the biggest baddest set of DBA rotors I can fit on a VL Commodore with 17" rims? I want to use this for serious racing and road use. Also will AP racing 6 piston calipers go well with the rotors too?

Cheers.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by T-BONE
dbasteve, what is the biggest baddest set of DBA rotors I can fit on a VL Commodore with 17" rims? I want to use this for serious racing and road use. Also will AP racing 6 piston calipers go well with the rotors too?

Cheers.

The best option is a DBA 019 VP HSV rotor 330mm x 28mm. This is a hub type rotor which fits straight on your VL with 17"s.
The ideal caliper would be an AP Racing CP5570 series which suits a 28mm rotor.

[T-BONE]

Are they slotted? Also how much difference is there in the high end rotors? Would it be worth going to AP Racing rotors?

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by T-BONE
Are they slotted? Also how much difference is there in the high end rotors? Would it be worth going to AP Racing rotors?

Yes they do come in slotted.
The problem you would have in going to a full racing setup is that your stub axle is set up for hub type rotors ( integral bearings).
If you wanted to go all the way you would have set up your struts to take steel hubs and hat type rotors like the VS/VT.
If you did this then the skies the limit for options.

Quite a lot of the older Tickford touring cars have steel hubs made for them so they can use Mustang hat type rotors.

[T-BONE]

Thanks for taking the time to answer our questions dbasteve. It's definitely a damn good thing to have an expert on the boards for respective car departments.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Rads63
I know that this may not be your area, but do you know where I can get hold of a set of longer wheel studs for a commodore (m12 x1.25 if im not mistaken ) as I really dont want to drill out my hubs and go with 1/2" studs and nuts ect.
If you could point me in the right direction it would be a real plus.
Cheers

I have a contact for your wheel studs

Nice Products
PH 02 9550 4044
Peter

I am told they import studs for all applications

[Beavis]

Hi Steve,

Good to see you on the list - it's always excellent to see a manufacturer out supporting the community, especially when they're doing it at a technical level. Everybody wins..

Regarding that WRX running the APs (the photo you posted).. what's he using for brake pads, gravel?! :D The rotor surface looks nice and scratched.. :rolleyes:


Chris

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Chris
Hi Steve,

Good to see you on the list - it's always excellent to see a manufacturer out supporting the community, especially when they're doing it at a technical level. Everybody wins..

Regarding that WRX running the APs (the photo you posted).. what's he using for brake pads, gravel?! :D The rotor surface looks nice and scratched.. :rolleyes:


Chris

Gravel.....:(
Actually Pagid Blue, but they faded and dumped loads of resin on the disc. Time to rub them back.

Your right "Everybody wins"
We think it is best to offer technical info direct to the user especially with all the new high tech pads, rotors, and calipers that are available. This way you can decide what you need knowing what's available rather someone selling you an item because it has the biggest margin on it....;)
As i said in the beginning I dont sell em, I make them.

This forum is obviously the place to be...:cool:

[slick]

Originally posted by T-BONE


dbasteve, what is the biggest baddest set of DBA rotors I can fit on a VL Commodore with 17" rims? I want to use this for serious racing and road use. Also will AP racing 6 piston calipers go well with the rotors too?

Originally posted by dbasteve


The best option is a DBA 019 VP HSV rotor 330mm x 28mm. This is a hub type rotor which fits straight on your VL with 17"s.
The ideal caliper would be an AP Racing CP5570 series which suits a 28mm rotor.

I am wondering for future reference value [read:when i have some money :D]. If using the 019s, would you use the VP mounting bracket for the 4 spots that the HSVs ran? Or would the VL Turbo [L stamped] brackets and calipers be up to the task?

Also while on the topic of early commodore's, how do you think replacing the rear discs with the 020s from the VP HSV as well? You'd need new handbrake drum pads, etc., master cylinder possibly. But the discs them selves would they be a fairly simple bolt up affair, ignoring the other details?


Just a thought if you're going to replace the fronts may as well replace the rears too... :D:D

[FatBoy]

Originally posted by dbasteve
Or I can forward you onto a workshop that does this on a regular basis.

If your in Sydney you can organise to come in and have a look at these bits. I have a good range of calipers too. Not for sale, I use them to check dimensions.

Cool, what workshop should i contact ??
I'm in Sydney (sth west), if that helps ??

Thanks for your time and help Steve... ;)
Paul...

[Group3JDatsun]

Originally posted by dbasteve


Carbon pads and carbon rotors are mainly for formula 1 where the temperatures are beyond the limitations of cast iron. Carbon rotors are very stable and have a low expansion rate. It also allow the cars to use smaller diameter brakes which = smaller wheels and lower centre of gravity. Lower centre of gravity = better wind resistance less inertia when cornering ect ect ect.

Oh yeh! They cost sh*t loads of money too. $4000 + per corner.

Pagid's are more into adhesion technology and are very good. Another good pad is Ferodo DS3000. Very similar to pagid Blue but can handle a bit more heat.

Interesting.....Pagid's use the sticky tech. Alot of people have told me they have good "feel", so I find that interesting. If they feel spongy, I wouldn't consider that to be "good" feel....anyhow, we'll find out on the 21st when we test with them for the first time...can't wait to see how it stops!! :)

I seem to remeber reading in Racecar Engineering that F1 brakes are capable of absorting something like 2000HP or some insane figure. Would love to experience THAT sort of stopping power.

Incidentally Steve, do you know how the colour range works in Pagids? I can't find info anywhere, to the point of emailing Pagid (now Mintex or something in the UK?) and they sent me the wrong info. I've got RS14 "Black" pads......I wanted RS14, but I don't understand the "Black" referance....

[Rads63]

Thanks for that tip, even found there web site and it had downloadable cataloges, rang em and they were a great help, had to order them through Repco, delivered to townsville in two working days, and the price was not to over the top ( $7 a stud )
there site is www.niceproducts.com.au
Thanks Steve

Cheers Rads

[EvilChief]

currently i got a STD setup on my AU Falcon, but the rotors are fairly badly worn (can't be machined any more). I was thinking of upgrading the rortors to DBA crossdrilled rotors, which effectively require me getting new breaking pads as well. do i have to get new calipers as well? anyhow i also heard that the crossdrilles aren't as good as slottered ones because they might overheat and crack and stuff like that (don't ask me how they got that, it's just something which got stucked in my head ... :rolleyes: ). well i went to one of our breaking guys here in TSV and he told me that the crossdrilled gonna cost me $200 ea (sounds kinda costy to me, especially when i got a quote from somewhere else for $220 a pair) - is he trying to rip me off or what's the deal with that? how much are the crossdrilled and the slottered ones for an AU Falcon? what sort of brak pads should i get? who would be the best person to buy them from, because there none here in TSV and they all try to rip you off in one way or another here ... ? Thx

[Chad]

Gday steve, your doing a great job on here mate.

I have a 1985 Hb model mazda 929 Hardtop. It currently runs a slotted single pot caliper hub type disc on the front of the car, I have been reading around and asking anyone that will listen or answer questions about brakes, thus far, i havent come to a definitei decision.

I sore you mention earlier that the Vp commodore hass a Hub type disc, with a redrill (if that possible with a hub type disc) are these able to be mated up to a car like mine? I understand about have larger calipers for larger discs, and i was after a disc at least 280mm in diameter, maybe larger, when the car gets back on the road, it should be roughly 1350kgs with me in it. This current discs are roughly 240mm.

I was wanting to do track sprint days and hill climbs etc. as well as some (maybe lots) street driving. U mentioned the AP 6 pot calipers were roughly 900 a piece, how much is a 4 pot caliper worth (roughly)?

thanks very muchly

Chad

p.s. ebc, pagid, ferrodo, do any of these manufacturers make a pad that is useable on the street and the track? or should i look at buying two sets of pads?

[Beavis]

Group3JDatsun: Steve might correct me here (and I won't mind! :D).. but I think the Pagid colour range indicates pad usage, with the lighter colours being more for the street, and darker being more race pads.

The colours I know of - in what I think is the correct order are - Yellow, Orange, Red, Blue, Black. So Yellow would be the friendliest out of those, whilst Black would mean you need to drive a kilometer or two to get the pads warmed up before they bite :D but when they do, by jesus you'll stop quickly..

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by slick




I am wondering for future reference value [read:when i have some money :D]. If using the 019s, would you use the VP mounting bracket for the 4 spots that the HSVs ran? Or would the VL Turbo [L stamped] brackets and calipers be up to the task?

Also while on the topic of early commodore's, how do you think replacing the rear discs with the 020s from the VP HSV as well? You'd need new handbrake drum pads, etc., master cylinder possibly. But the discs them selves would they be a fairly simple bolt up affair, ignoring the other details?


Just a thought if you're going to replace the fronts may as well replace the rears too... :D:D

To run 019's you would need the VP HSV callipers and brackets. The oversize VL brackets will only do the 290mm x 22mm rotor.
The ideal situation is to upgrade both front and rears to maintain a balanced braking system. For street use it isn't quite as important as for the track.
You may find that a VT calliper could be used with a suitable bracket.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Group3JDatsun


Interesting.....Pagid's use the sticky tech. Alot of people have told me they have good "feel", so I find that interesting. If they feel spongy, I wouldn't consider that to be "good" feel....anyhow, we'll find out on the 21st when we test with them for the first time...can't wait to see how it stops!! :)

I seem to remeber reading in Racecar Engineering that F1 brakes are capable of absorting something like 2000HP or some insane figure. Would love to experience THAT sort of stopping power.

Incidentally Steve, do you know how the colour range works in Pagids? I can't find info anywhere, to the point of emailing Pagid (now Mintex or something in the UK?) and they sent me the wrong info. I've got RS14 "Black" pads......I wanted RS14, but I don't understand the "Black" referance....

www.pagidusa.com
Look under Compound Characteristics

Pagid make an excellent product.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by ChiefBO
currently i got a STD setup on my AU Falcon, but the rotors are fairly badly worn (can't be machined any more). I was thinking of upgrading the rortors to DBA crossdrilled rotors, which effectively require me getting new breaking pads as well. do i have to get new calipers as well? anyhow i also heard that the crossdrilles aren't as good as slottered ones because they might overheat and crack and stuff like that (don't ask me how they got that, it's just something which got stucked in my head ... :rolleyes: ). well i went to one of our breaking guys here in TSV and he told me that the crossdrilled gonna cost me $200 ea (sounds kinda costy to me, especially when i got a quote from somewhere else for $220 a pair) - is he trying to rip me off or what's the deal with that? how much are the crossdrilled and the slottered ones for an AU Falcon? what sort of brak pads should i get? who would be the best person to buy them from, because there none here in TSV and they all try to rip you off in one way or another here ... ? Thx

Cross Drilled rotors are great if you are not carrying heavy loads. They do give maximum pad bite and work well in wet conditions.
I would not recommend C/Drill rotors for Utes or cars carrying heavy loads as they do generate more heat than slotted and with a car/ute carrying an extra few hundred kilos this can shorten the life of the product.
No calliper changes required.

www.discpads.com.au
This guy has been selling our product online for quite a few years and his prices are generally quite good.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Chad
Gday steve, your doing a great job on here mate.

I have a 1985 Hb model mazda 929 Hardtop. It currently runs a slotted single pot caliper hub type disc on the front of the car, I have been reading around and asking anyone that will listen or answer questions about brakes, thus far, i havent come to a definitei decision.

I sore you mention earlier that the Vp commodore hass a Hub type disc, with a redrill (if that possible with a hub type disc) are these able to be mated up to a car like mine? I understand about have larger calipers for larger discs, and i was after a disc at least 280mm in diameter, maybe larger, when the car gets back on the road, it should be roughly 1350kgs with me in it. This current discs are roughly 240mm.

I was wanting to do track sprint days and hill climbs etc. as well as some (maybe lots) street driving. U mentioned the AP 6 pot calipers were roughly 900 a piece, how much is a 4 pot caliper worth (roughly)?

thanks very muchly

Chad

p.s. ebc, pagid, ferrodo, do any of these manufacturers make a pad that is useable on the street and the track? or should i look at buying two sets of pads?

Matching up Hub type rotors is not easy. Fortunately Holden used the same strut for years which works like a mecanno set.
What has been done on Mazda's is converting the car to take Hat type rotors by fitting a hub to the stub axle and then using a R32 Skyline rotor 280mm x 30mm.
Those AP's are suited to 300mm plus rotors. You probably would do better finding some R32 GTS callipers for $400-$600 pair and fitting them with a bracket.
Pagid RS-42 and Ferodo DS2500 are good for street and track.

If you PM me I can give you a contact for guys that have done Mazda Upgrades.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Chris
Group3JDatsun: Steve might correct me here (and I won't mind! :D).. but I think the Pagid colour range indicates pad usage, with the lighter colours being more for the street, and darker being more race pads.

The colours I know of - in what I think is the correct order are - Yellow, Orange, Red, Blue, Black. So Yellow would be the friendliest out of those, whilst Black would mean you need to drive a kilometer or two to get the pads warmed up before they bite :D but when they do, by jesus you'll stop quickly..

Correction...:D
It used to be that easy, but now there is No RS9 Yellow, 2 Blues, 2 Blacks, a new Yellow, a new Orange and my head hurts.

www.pagidusa.com
The U.S.A Pagid site is good.

[dbasteve]

I hope I haven't miss any one as I'm moving into the DBA Brake Clinic now.

This Excellent response has allowed us to set up home on this site. Thanks to Nick (owner)

[Group3JDatsun]

Originally posted by dbasteve


www.pagidusa.com
Look under Compound Characteristics

Pagid make an excellent product.

Many thanks Steve. I checked it out, much better than the UK site...

cheers

[Emre]

I have nothing to ask.

Just read the whole thread and would like to say how awesome it is for dbasteve to answer every question coming his way with facts and past experiences. This obviously benefits all parties involved.

When i am up for rotors i won't be going for the Jap route for once !!!

:worship:

[hotgemini]

ChiefBO,

(note: I'm assuming that you have an AU series one, lemme know if it is a S2/3)

As I've mentioned in another post in the brakes forum, I'm involved with two AU XR8 drive day cars which retain the standard braking package. We run DBA slotted rotors and they handle the abuse extremely well, especially compared to the no-name rotors which used to crack and fail in one session.

For pads we run ferodo excels and these are quite good (for a road pad), they could have a little more cold bite, but I'm nit-picking... for the price they are a good pad.

I do have one suggestion for you, go to your local ford dealership and order the Tickford master cylinder, it is larger (1 inch vs. 7/8ths or some cr#p) and improves the pedal feel ten times.

Originally posted by dbasteve

www.discpads.com.au
This guy has been selling our product online for quite a few years and his prices are generally quite good.

I am boycotting discpads.com.au due to their sponsorship of Geoff Full (GT-P EVO7), a man who I would rather chew my own arm off than be associated with.

[Hqcoupe350]

dbasteve: I've just recently upgraded my HQ Monaro's front brakes with replacement DBA Golds and Ultimate pads, which I must say have made a HUGE difference in braking ability.

My question is, whats invoved in converting to VT twin piston calipers? Is it a relatively straightforward conversion? I've got 14 inch rims at the moment, is there going to be any clearance problems?

[damianf]

Hi dbasteve,

Let me just start this post by saying how good it is to have someone answering questions like this. Well done.

My question is about the brakes on my vl turbo. Under moderate to heavy braking there is a loud humming noise that seems to have gotten worse. My rotors are cross drilled and slotted - does this noise mean the discs are getting too thin or is it relatively normal? There looks to be quite a bit of pad left on both sides.

If I do need new discs, is the biggest I can go with standard calipers 290mm (I have 16" wheels)?

Thanks for any help you can provide mate.

Regards,
Damian.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Hqcoupe350
dbasteve: I've just recently upgraded my HQ Monaro's front brakes with replacement DBA Golds and Ultimate pads, which I must say have made a HUGE difference in braking ability.

My question is, whats invoved in converting to VT twin piston calipers? Is it a relatively straightforward conversion? I've got 14 inch rims at the moment, is there going to be any clearance problems?

I'm going to check with a guy that knows a lot more than me about the HQ.

Rather than spinning you a tale...;)

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by damianf
Hi dbasteve,

Let me just start this post by saying how good it is to have someone answering questions like this. Well done.

My question is about the brakes on my vl turbo. Under moderate to heavy braking there is a loud humming noise that seems to have gotten worse. My rotors are cross drilled and slotted - does this noise mean the discs are getting too thin or is it relatively normal? There looks to be quite a bit of pad left on both sides.

If I do need new discs, is the biggest I can go with standard calipers 290mm (I have 16" wheels)?

Thanks for any help you can provide mate.

Regards,
Damian.

You will always have some noise from the holes and slot working but if it increases you will find you probably have glazed pads.

Some metal pads will make more noise too. A Bendix metal king will be noisier than an Ultimate because of the hardness of the pad which reduces its compressability.
If you have that real glassy look on your rotors then give the pads a rub on some emery paper to open the grain again.

The VL turbo caliper will only take the 290mm rotors. Bigger rotors means bigger wheels.

[Roberto]

Originally posted by dbasteve
If you can fit a VT size rotor in your wheels ( 15" ) we make heat treated flat type rotors that can be mounted on Aluminium hats for this type of application.
Combine this with an AP Racing 6 piston caliper CP5570 and you will have a stable, low fade, race quality setup.

We make these discs for WRX rally and track cars and they can handle anything you can throw at them.

http://www.dba.com.au/forum/5000_b1.jpg

Hi Steve,
Could you give me some more info on the above rotors ie sizes available/dimensions/cost?

I am considering this type of upgrade for my GTI-R. Currently I run slotted DBA901's with Ultimate pads which are ok on the street but I want something better for trackdays.

I'm thinking Nissan 4 pot calipers (R32 GTR/R33 GTS-T) and a ~310mm rotor to go over 16" track rims (I run 18's on the street).
Using the above style rotors I would then get caliper brackets and a rotor centre machined to suit. Hopefully avoiding offset problems associated with some of the upgrades i've seen using a one piece rotor and avoiding wheel spacers and suspension geometry changes.

Down the track I might even look at using a larger rear rotor (~310mm) also but keep the existing caliper (with integral hand brake) and add some caliper brackets but this may mean custom rotors and big $$$.

Thanks

Roberto

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Roberto


Hi Steve,
Could you give me some more info on the above rotors ie sizes available/dimensions/cost?

I am considering this type of upgrade for my GTI-R. Currently I run slotted DBA901's with Ultimate pads which are ok on the street but I want something better for trackdays.

I'm thinking Nissan 4 pot calipers (R32 GTR/R33 GTS-T) and a ~310mm rotor to go over 16" track rims (I run 18's on the street).
Using the above style rotors I would then get caliper brackets and a rotor centre machined to suit. Hopefully avoiding offset problems associated with some of the upgrades i've seen using a one piece rotor and avoiding wheel spacers and suspension geometry changes.

Down the track I might even look at using a larger rear rotor (~310mm) also but keep the existing caliper (with integral hand brake) and add some caliper brackets but this may mean custom rotors and big $$$.

Thanks

Roberto

Roberto,
The rotor in the picture is 295mm x 25.4mm x 50mm offset.
The next size up is 326mm x 30mm x 46mm offset.

The rotor blanks ( no hats) Range from 280mm to 381mm
Thickness = 26mm, 28mm, 30mm, 32mm.

The one pictured would be ideal for your car. You could try a WRX 4 piston caliper or an AP Racing CP 5570 (6 pist) or CP5200 ( 4 pist) caliper.

[Boxer]

Steve,

Whats your thoughts on pad material breaking away and stress cracks. If a pad used for track work exhibits some hairline cracks and a small area where the compound has broken away (like a small divot in the centre) - are they stuffed?

I have a set like this but they still perform magnificently - i have been told that since my car has a sliding caliper arrangement that the flex in the caliper causes the stress cracks

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Boxer
Steve,

Whats your thoughts on pad material breaking away and stress cracks. If a pad used for track work exhibits some hairline cracks and a small area where the compound has broken away (like a small divot in the centre) - are they stuffed?

I have a set like this but they still perform magnificently - i have been told that since my car has a sliding caliper arrangement that the flex in the caliper causes the stress cracks

Pads will crack and pull away when they are wasted of resin in the compound. They tend to harden up and chew the rotors sometimes resulting in cracking discs.
Without seeing the pads it is hard to tell for sure. Generally you start to lose lumps on the trailing edge of the pad first when they are wasted. Also keep an eye out for a dark blue discolouration or metal pickup on the disc.

What pads are they?

[Boxer]

Originally posted by dbasteve


Pads will crack and pull away when they are wasted of resin in the compound. They tend to harden up and chew the rotors sometimes resulting in cracking discs.
Without seeing the pads it is hard to tell for sure. Generally you start to lose lumps on the trailing edge of the pad first when they are wasted. Also keep an eye out for a dark blue discolouration or metal pickup on the disc.

What pads are they?

They are Porterfield R4

No problems on the traiing edge of the pads, just a small lump in the centre - also very kind to rotors, negligable wear

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Boxer


They are Porterfield R4

No problems on the traiing edge of the pads, just a small lump in the centre - also very kind to rotors, negligable wear

They should be O.K then.
I don't know about the lump in the middle then without seeing them.

Where did you get the Porterfields from in Australia?
I've heard they are good but haven't brought any in from the U.S yet.

[Boxer]

Hi Steve,

The Porterfields were bought over the internet from Porterfield themselves. Yes they are very impressive, but too dusty for the street.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Boxer
Hi Steve,

The Porterfields were bought over the internet from Porterfield themselves. Yes they are very impressive, but too dusty for the street.

Thanks

[Dash_Cordia]

Hey steve,
just wondering about something and hopefully you can offer some advice :)
Im thinking of getting the aussie spec Nissan S12 Gazelle and putting in a ca18det.. anyways im definatley going to need to upgrade the front disc setup..
Do you know what fits on the s12 and if so how much bigger are they?
thanx in advance ;)

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Dash_Cordia
Hey steve,
just wondering about something and hopefully you can offer some advice :)
Im thinking of getting the aussie spec Nissan S12 Gazelle and putting in a ca18det.. anyways im definatley going to need to upgrade the front disc setup..
Do you know what fits on the s12 and if so how much bigger are they?
thanx in advance ;)

I've had a few requests for a disc to fit this 73mm x 4 stud hub and unfortunately I can't find a easy bolt on solution. Unless someone pops up who's done some wizardry, I can only suggest you go to a brake specialist and have them mount up an Aluminium hatted two piece rotor. Then your only restricted by wheel size and associated clearances.
These standard flat type discs come in sizes 280mm, 296mm, 305mm, 330mm and on up to 381mm

[Dash_Cordia]

No worries... thanx for the quick reply and the advice :)

Cheers

[hotgemini]

Originally posted by dbasteve

The rotor blanks ( no hats) Range from 280mm to 381mm
Thickness = 26mm, 28mm, 30mm, 32mm.


So you make a 280x32mm rotor? hmm, ver' tempting idea if the 926's won't fit.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by Hotgemini


So you make a 280x32mm rotor? hmm, ver' tempting idea if the 926's won't fit.

The 280mm disc is 26mm thick. The flat disc's don't get into 32mm thick until about 325mm diameter.

[hotgemini]

:(

[EVOSTi]

g'day just found this thread, heaps good :) heres my Q.

ive got a toyota sprinter with much more power than stock (supercharged engine worked) and am in deffinate need of a brake upgrade over the standard solid discs. whats my best option? i was thinking about getting series 4 rx7 discs and calipers addapted to my car but requires much custom work (custom = $$$). is there any caliper/rotor combination that will bolt onto my sprinter struts and fit in my 15 inch rims?
thanks for any help.

[dbasteve]

What may be worth a look for both you guys is a DBA 909 undrilled 280mm x 30mm. Its off an R32 GTS Skyline but we sell quite a few undrilled for this sort of work.

[EVOSTi]

thank you for the quick reply.
what calipers would you suggest with these discs? would my offset or stud pattern be altered?

[SiMMMo]

Ok, I've already posted in the main page but I thought I would post here too....

I'm looking for an upgrade for my MKIV supra.....

it currently has the 295mm spec rotors on the front - i'm looking at getting completely new brakes....

I'd want at least 330mm dia.... width I guess 30mm+?

What are my options? I dont want to get *too* exxy....... whats the difference in price between AP 4 pots and 6 pots?

also, would I be better to get blank rotors and get them drilled - or do you already make them in the spec I need.

Also, are most the rotors in that size 2 piece or 1? and are there any other benefits other than price (eg replacement price) in getting a 2piece?

what sort of prices would I be looking at? Cheers,

Simon.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by SiMMMo
Ok, I've already posted in the main page but I thought I would post here too....

I'm looking for an upgrade for my MKIV supra.....

it currently has the 295mm spec rotors on the front - i'm looking at getting completely new brakes....

I'd want at least 330mm dia.... width I guess 30mm+?

What are my options? I dont want to get *too* exxy....... whats the difference in price between AP 4 pots and 6 pots?

also, would I be better to get blank rotors and get them drilled - or do you already make them in the spec I need.

Also, are most the rotors in that size 2 piece or 1? and are there any other benefits other than price (eg replacement price) in getting a 2piece?

what sort of prices would I be looking at? Cheers,

Simon.

We have JZA80 Twin Turbo Supra rotors 323mm x 30. Same centre bore, Stud holes, offset ect. DBA 718
You may be able to use the JZA 80 Caliper. The AP's for the 30/32mm discs are close to $1000 ea..:eek:

We may be doing this one in a two piece early next year.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by EVOSTi
thank you for the quick reply.
what calipers would you suggest with these discs? would my offset or stud pattern be altered?

You would get these discs drilled to match your current stud pattern, but the offset will naturally have to change with the thicker rotors. Try to source a S/Hand Skyline caliper for these discs.

[simon010]

Steve

i noticed in one of the attached pics a machined surface finish (looks like a series of scratches . . . . . )

i have seen this finish on wilwood disks and am wondering about the different types of surface finish and how it affects disks bedding in and if any affects on pads?

regards

simon oaten

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by simon010
Steve

i noticed in one of the attached pics a machined surface finish (looks like a series of scratches . . . . . )

i have seen this finish on wilwood disks and am wondering about the different types of surface finish and how it affects disks bedding in and if any affects on pads?

regards

simon oaten

The disc in that picture has been rubbed back with emery paper to remove resin deposits from a rally event.

There are a few different methods of producing acceptable surface finishes for rotors. Fine turning, Grinding, Honing are all used to make disc bedding easier. Disc turning produces a scroll effect like an old music record and if this finish is too course it grabs the pad and pulls it down until the resistance from the caliper makes it jump back up into place. This is commonly known as pad knock which can cause problems when bedding the disc by leaving irregular layers of resin material.

The fine turning method we use produces a very fine surface finish which does not affect the pad bedding. This a very common method used by most manufacturers today.

[Nafe]

Would the black streaks on the disc here be an example of the resin deposits? This is after my EBC Green stuffs have bedded in fully. Previously the black marking was more prominent and located only towards the inner diameter of the disc surface.

http://www.netspace.net.au/~nathanwong/R0010313.JPG

Cheers
Nathan

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by satria_gti
Would the black streaks on the disc here be an example of the resin deposits? This is after my EBC Green stuffs have bedded in fully. Previously the black marking was more prominent and located only towards the inner diameter of the disc surface.

Cheers
Nathan

The streaking in the centre of the braking surface looks like resin.

It doesn't appear to be large deposits like some of the problem discs where the build up is only in a few areas but quite heavy. If it's not giving you any grief then don't worry, but keep an eye on it.

[Nafe]

Thanks Steve.

The brakes are working nicely right now, Wakefield on Thursday will really test them though.

Cheers
Nathan

[2rotor2]

im looking to do a front brake upgrade on my 71 Rx2 as it has standard front discs and Hilux rear drums.
What (if any) discs and calipers will go straight onto my model car?, other rxs ive seen use magna-commadore-volvo brakes or combinations of them. I thought buying the parts would be cheaper than getting a package from mazfix or someone similar?, as im on a limited budget?
regards
2rotor2

[PintaraPower]

DBASteve,

I have a Pintara station wagon which shares the same brake set up as a skyline. I have put the import HR31 GTS front disc's and calipers on.

Firstly I need to know Sizes of Standard r31 discs front and rear and their GTS equivilents (As far as i know Aus spec and Jap Spec GTS's shared brakes).

Also the Size of brake boosters of each would also help.


My second question is what type of upgrade can i look at disc wise, I already have a Pair of 4 pot calipers in the shed, will these alone be a big improvement? I get a fair bit of brake fade after 2 or 3 big stops. I could be the pads too though.


Thanks alot for any help.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by PintaraPower
DBASteve,

I have a Pintara station wagon which shares the same brake set up as a skyline. I have put the import HR31 GTS front disc's and calipers on.

Firstly I need to know Sizes of Standard r31 discs front and rear and their GTS equivilents (As far as i know Aus spec and Jap Spec GTS's shared brakes).

Also the Size of brake boosters of each would also help.


My second question is what type of upgrade can i look at disc wise, I already have a Pair of 4 pot calipers in the shed, will these alone be a big improvement? I get a fair bit of brake fade after 2 or 3 big stops. I could be the pads too though.


Thanks alot for any help.

The R31 front rotors are DBA 924 which are 274mm dia x 22mm thick, 47mm high, 4 Stud. This is the same for local and import.
I'm not surprised about your fade problem with these discs.

There are three options for upgrading which will depend on wheel size and these calipers you have.

1. DBA 909 Undrilled 280mm x 30mm ( Extra thickness will handle more heat) The centre bore is the same but you'll need to have the stud holes drilled to suit. 15" wheels

2. DBA 926 Undrilled 296mm x 32mm ( Bigger dia for more torque and handle more heat) Same centre bore again. Requires 16"s

3. DBA 928 Undrilled 324mm x 30mm ( more torque again. You may headbutt the steering wheel with these) Requires 17"s

[taivu]

I have a Bluebird u13 sr20det 4wd, the replacement rotors in your catalog are 903 but does not come in x-drilled, but you have 919 that are for silvia and 180sx it has all the same dimensions except the 903 are 49.2 compared to 49 for the 919 in the "b" category of measurment.

Would I be able to use the 919 on my car? And also does that new kanga paw design feature in the 903 or 919?


Thanks,

Tai.

[slick]

Just thought I'd say hi dbasteve...

"HI"


P.S. I saw a photo of a steve from the DBA factory in a magazine of my olds, that wouldn't be you by any chance dbasteve? Doing factory tours?

:)

[John Reveley]

GTIR Brake Help
Hi, Just looking for some advice on a good brake upgrade for My GTI-R Nissan pulsar, I have browsed a few catalogs (DBA) and not found any specific rotors for my car. I understand that the brakes differ from that of the usuall N14 (in fact measured values look more like the N15). What I am after is a good street setup and I have to say that I am not too hard on the car, but it does need to stop better. The idea of cross drilled rotors and some good street pads sounds good, and if anybody knows the correct DBA rotor numbers for the GTI-R that would be a good start.

Many thanks


John Reveley

[NOT24L]

Originally posted by taivu
I have a Bluebird u13 sr20det 4wd, the replacement rotors in your catalog are 903 but does not come in x-drilled, but you have 919 that are for silvia and 180sx it has all the same dimensions except the 903 are 49.2 compared to 49 for the 919 in the "b" category of measurment.

Would I be able to use the 919 on my car? And also does that new kanga paw design feature in the 903 or 919?


Thanks,

Tai.


They are not the same as the 180SX. The "C" thickness on the U13 Attesa is 26mm (but more like 28mm as mine have been machined). I just measured mine up. A, B and C reads 280, 48 and 26mm.

I just called DBA to see if they had anything that fitted and they said to try factory!!

[monovich]

Hello. I recently picked up a set of take-off Subaru 4 pot / 2pot brakes for all four corners of my car that included hubs, rotors, calipers and pads. I don't know which year car the brakes came off of. I took it to my local suby shop and we decided that I should get new rotors and pads because of the wear on the current set. Everyone has been raving about dba rotors on i-club, so I've come here to inquire.

What I need to know is how to determine specifically which rotors I need. Through my browsing I've already determined that I want slotted/drilled rotors, but I'm not sure which ones are compatable with my brakes. I've heard from a few sources that it depends on which parking brake I have (190mm/170mm). So is there a way that I can visually determine exactly which rotors I need to get based on the brakes that I have? I use my car for street driving mostly, but often take her out to the hills and toss her around a bit.

thanks for the help.

-Steve F.

edit: my wheels are P7s if that makes any difference.

[dattoman1000]

Measure the overall diameter
This would be a good starting guide as to what your originals are.
If they are 4 spot fronts and they aren';t brembos they are probably DBA650.
You can get these in various forms as you have probably seen. Inc 2 piece and the new "Club Spec".
With 2 spot rears they are probably DBA649
unless your in the U.S. in which case you might have different rears. pull them off and check the handbrake daimeter too if this is the case.

Good hunting

[ali g]

i have a silvia K ca18det 1990 and have done a lot of work to the eng and i cant stop that quick any more.

what can i do with the brakes i want to stop?

can i change the discs or the whole system what do i do?

and what parts?

[dattoman1000]

Don't quote me on this...do some measurements.

But from memory I think it goes like this.

DBA909 discs redrilled to 4 stud pattern
R33 skyline front 4 piston calipers
2mm thick spacer washers between strut and caliper
longer hoses....I think

Hope this helps.
If you get stuck go see either

Speedworks in Subiaco or
SST autos in Radium St Welshpool..

I'm sure they have both done it before.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by slick
Just thought I'd say hi dbasteve...

"HI"


P.S. I saw a photo of a steve from the DBA factory in a magazine of my olds, that wouldn't be you by any chance dbasteve? Doing factory tours?

:)

No thats not me. That's Steve Borg the training guy. I live down in the engine room.:)

[gtrken]

Steve, top job on the question and answer session.
Have a 32GTR which I will be using for Targa again but am sick of killing the rotors, pads and calipers.

When are you making the two piece rotor hats for front and are you making up the rears with the integral h/brake drum ?

Will the 2 piece rotors you sell be up to it ( 1680kg all up inc driv/nav ) and speeds to haul down from 200 to 60 odd constantly?
Will those AP cp5570 6 pistons be ok and what would I use on the rear to retain brake balance ( can't use a balance bar but will run the BM57 inch and a sixteenth 300zx m/cyl )

Have used Pagid blues in the past and your previous postings has explained a lot of questions for me re. glazing, resin dumping and consequent disc cracking from overheating.
BTW I can tell you that the std 280mm 300zx disc I used on the car in Targa ( was desperate and swapped whole combo off a 300zx onto the GTR ) lasted about 1 day before cracking too bad.
Ken

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by gtrken
Steve, top job on the question and answer session.
Have a 32GTR which I will be using for Targa again but am sick of killing the rotors, pads and calipers.

When are you making the two piece rotor hats for front and are you making up the rears with the integral h/brake drum ?

Will the 2 piece rotors you sell be up to it ( 1680kg all up inc driv/nav ) and speeds to haul down from 200 to 60 odd constantly?
Will those AP cp5570 6 pistons be ok and what would I use on the rear to retain brake balance ( can't use a balance bar but will run the BM57 inch and a sixteenth 300zx m/cyl )

Have used Pagid blues in the past and your previous postings has explained a lot of questions for me re. glazing, resin dumping and consequent disc cracking from overheating.
BTW I can tell you that the std 280mm 300zx disc I used on the car in Targa ( was desperate and swapped whole combo off a 300zx onto the GTR ) lasted about 1 day before cracking too bad.
Ken
Ken,
Let's keep the 280mm discs for the shopping trollies hey.!
We have the 324mm rotors made for the GTR two piece and I finished the hat design on the weekend. It will take at least 3 to 4 weeks to have the hats machined and strength tested before any can be released. The rotors we are already using on the WRX STi 02 two piece rotor and they are doing well.

The AP5570's are designed for a 28mm rotor and these are 30mm (as per O.E dimensions). You may need to use a 2mm spacer or do some tinkering to clear the width. The 6 piston calipers should not upset the balance only improve the feel. Any small variation can be fixed with a different grade of pad. Pagid and Ferodo make pads for rear aplications like this.
We have no plans to modify rears at this stage. It is very risky to do an Aluminium handbrake bore as it is too easy to distort the Aluminium hat and screw up a set of hats and rotors. Unless you were running a handbrake caliper I wouldn't recomend two piece on the rear.
Are these rotors up to it? Yes :)
BTW Have you tried Ferodo DS3000 on your car?

[FASTVP]

What discs and calipers do you recommend for a VP V8?
I'm starting to spend too much money on everything else in my car, so I think it would be a good idea to start looking at the brakes...

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by FASTVP
What discs and calipers do you recommend for a VP V8?
I'm starting to spend too much money on everything else in my car, so I think it would be a good idea to start looking at the brakes...

DBA 019 Slotted ( HUB Type VP V8 HSV) rotors and HSV or C4 Corvette Calipers.
or
Steel hub conversion to VS/VT with DBA 046 ( HAT Type HSV ) rotors with HSV or C4 Corvette Calipers.

Both are 13"/330mm brakes

Braided steel lines and good tyres. Its important to have good tyres especially when doing brake upgrades.

[wizsupra]

Originally posted by SiMMMo
Ok, I've already posted in the main page but I thought I would post here too....

I'm looking for an upgrade for my MKIV supra.....

it currently has the 295mm spec rotors on the front - i'm looking at getting completely new brakes....

I'd want at least 330mm dia.... width I guess 30mm+?

What are my options? I dont want to get *too* exxy....... whats the difference in price between AP 4 pots and 6 pots?

also, would I be better to get blank rotors and get them drilled - or do you already make them in the spec I need.

Also, are most the rotors in that size 2 piece or 1? and are there any other benefits other than price (eg replacement price) in getting a 2piece?

what sort of prices would I be looking at? Cheers,

Simon.

To use the 323mm Supra rotors you will need to upgrade your calipers to the Supra 4 pot calipers. They are a straight fit and are not expensive from wreckers or importers.

Love the DBA slotted rotors.


PM me for more info.

[dazza]

I am looking for some new rotors eventually...

I have a Jan84 Pulsar EXA I think the part I am after is DBA303?

Or am I after 319? Which is stated from the 9th/84 onwards?

The 303 comes in Slotted/Crossdrilled, but the 319 doesn't?

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by dazza
I am looking for some new rotors eventually...

I have a Jan84 Pulsar EXA I think the part I am after is DBA303?

Or am I after 319? Which is stated from the 9th/84 onwards?

The 303 comes in Slotted/Crossdrilled, but the 319 doesn't?

The DBA 319 is off a Turbo EXA and the one you should be after is the DBA 303.
The DBA 303 is a solid disc and the DBA 319 is vented. We don't Cross Drill this vented disc because the O.E design is too thin on the pad faces to drill. If we did so it would crack like an egg shell. Not a good look.

[sssgtr]

Steve,
Just a quick one about slotting std rotors, i'm doing a 180sx front rotor swap on my 92 Pintara T (using std calipers with spacers to fit the rotors and EBC greenstuff pads), i've priced DBA already slotted rotors for the 180, about $200 a pop, i know std replacement rotors are cheaper and i can get these slotted for around $25 ea rotor (John @ alloy race components in melb).
Is there any heat treatment performed by DBA after the rotors have been slotted by you guys before they are shipped out?
Thanks
:D

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by sssgtr
Steve,
Just a quick one about slotting std rotors, i'm doing a 180sx front rotor swap on my 92 Pintara T (using std calipers with spacers to fit the rotors and EBC greenstuff pads), i've priced DBA already slotted rotors for the 180, about $200 a pop, i know std replacement rotors are cheaper and i can get these slotted for around $25 ea rotor (John @ alloy race components in melb).
Is there any heat treatment performed by DBA after the rotors have been slotted by you guys before they are shipped out?
Thanks
:D

What we do is .................................................. .....................................
.................................................. ..........................................
.................................................. ..........................................
.................................................. ...................... and then they are packed for stock.

Come on give me a break!:D

[sssgtr]

Hmmmm.....fair enough! COULD you recommend anyone in Melbourne who i maybe able to speak about such if it is neccessary OR recommended? :D

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by sssgtr
Hmmmm.....fair enough! COULD you recommend anyone in Melbourne who i maybe able to speak about such if it is neccessary OR recommended? :D

Your certainly persistent.
Sorry, but there are certain things I can't discuss in public.

I doubt you'll find anyone who knows much about this. Most workshops don't even think about it. Try EBC Brakes, they claim to be experts.

[sssgtr]

Ok, thanks anyway! One last question, is there any particular type steel/alloy you'd recommend for the caliper spacers and if so, would 5mm thick do?

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by sssgtr
Ok, thanks anyway! One last question, is there any particular type steel/alloy you'd recommend for the caliper spacers and if so, would 5mm thick do?

K1045 steel.
A 5mm thick bracket will probably vibrate and squeal. 10 to 15mm is common but it depends on how much you are moving it from the original position.

[Gradenko]

I've been running on minimum rotor thickness for some time now, so its time to replace or hopefully, upgrade them. The car is a R33 GTS25t.

A common upgrade for Z32s (which use the same caliper) is to use 326mm rotors from the R33/R34 GTR, along with the appropriate caliper adaptor to space the factory caliper. This would be a good (cheap) upgrade for the R33, it offers a 10% increase in diameter over the standard 296mm rotors. The problem for me is that it seems this sort of combination does not fit under 16" wheels. Can anyone confirm this?

The 2nd choice is to go for 315mm VR4 (our 3000GT) rotors. The benfit being that it should fit under 16" wheels, and the downside being that a 15mm wheel spacer is needed due to height differences. Its a good upgrade for Z's as thier rotors are 280mm, but for the R33, its only a 6% increase in diameter over the standard rotors. So would it even be worth considering?

The final choice is to stick with slotted dba factory replacements and hold off on upgrades until I have bigger wheels necessary for big rotors.

[dbasteve]

It all depends on what you want from the braking system.

You can make a huge difference to braking performance with better pads and tyres.

Bigger rotors will increase torque slightly but more importantly give better heat capacity. The downside is you need bigger wheels.
Wheel spacers are illegal and can dramatically change your suspension characteristics especially with a 15mm change in the track.

[GeminiDiesel]

Have a current model Astra, factory pads are horrible (noisy, terrible black dust, and very hard on the rotors ie: high rate of wear. (seems pretty typical on european cars eg:BMW too)
Do you have any suggestions for better pads- less dust, less rotor wear, and good feel..... Please:confused:

[F|sh]

i have a fairly easy one

How do i run in my new disc rotors?

i have dba slotted solid rotors for my racegem

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by GeminiDiesel
Have a current model Astra, factory pads are horrible (noisy, terrible black dust, and very hard on the rotors ie: high rate of wear. (seems pretty typical on european cars eg:BMW too)
Do you have any suggestions for better pads- less dust, less rotor wear, and good feel..... Please:confused:

Try Lucas pads.
You contact ATAP for their QLD distibutors. www.atap.com.au

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by F|sh
i have a fairly easy one

How do i run in my new disc rotors?

i have dba slotted solid rotors for my racegem

http://www.dba.com.au/WRX/wrx_bedding_in.asp

Same deal with your rotors. Ignore the heat paint references.

[Bob Saget]

Steve,

I bought some slotted and crossed drilled rotors for my VN SS (fitted with VT front brakes) and bendex ultimate pads. The rotors lasted all of 2 weeks ( not blaming dba :( i know they aren't meant for hard driving, now). Anyway I was thinking of replacing them with Slotted rotors and EBC Blue stuff pads, will slotted rotors take a abuse better than the slotted and x-drilled ? I haven't done any track work yet but plan to once i get some coil-overs fitted, the brakes would be used very hard for upto 45mins most weekends, my step bro has a yamaha R1 and i tag along on their rides.

Also are you planning on releasing DBA 5000's to fit a standard VT and would waiting for these be a better choice? Sorry for the questions but no-one around my area has a clue about brakes :mad:

Thanks

BTW the cracking on these rotors is pretty impressive, i'd be happy to send you a pic if you'd like.

[dattoman1000]

DBA slotted rotors are the go
EBC Bluestuff are endurance race pads.....not street pads.

Maybe you need a set of pads for street and another for track.
Are the Ultimates standing up to it ?
Maybe you need to get some DS2500 custom cut for your calipers.
Or Pagid RS4-2

Over to you Steve for the 5000 series 040's

[Bob Saget]

Originally posted by dattoman1000
DBA slotted rotors are the go
EBC Bluestuff are endurance race pads.....not street pads.

Maybe you need a set of pads for street and another for track.
Are the Ultimates standing up to it ?
Maybe you need to get some DS2500 custom cut for your calipers.
Or Pagid RS4-2

Over to you Steve for the 5000 series 040's

I takes about 2-3mins of hard driving on a twisty road before the brakes start to fade and they are starting to fall apart.

Would something like a EBC redstuff pads be a better choice ? I dont really want to spend alot of money on customs pads because i'm going to upgrade to some 18" BBS rims and fit AP brakes towards the end of this year.

Edit: Also do DBA make a vented rear rotor to fit my car, because the x-drilled rear ones heat up too fast :)

[dattoman1000]

That would have been my next suggestion.....upgrade to something better.

You'd be supprised what the DS2500 Ferodo's are worth for how good they are.
Redstuff would be a good pad for it I'd think. I've only ever sold one set of them and that was to a guy in Sydney. I'm in Perth. He couldn't get them anywhere and wanted them for a track weeekend urgent.
Obviously I never got any feedback on them.
DBA Steve has tested alot of compounds on the brake tester. he might have tried reds.He might be able to give you some info on properties.

[dbasteve]

Fats,
Stock rotors are too small for the VN / VT considering the type of driving you are doing.
We make a range of HSV rotors that can be used for upgrades including a two piece 343mm and soon 356mm diameter rotor. We are also developing bracket kits to take a CP 5555 AP racing caliper which is ideal for this car. The rear can be upgraded to VT/VX HSV also with little fuss. The rear is still one piece but 315mm diameter and vented.

The HSV two piece rotors are heat treated to condition the rotors for the constant heat cycling of track use. We ran quite a few treated rotors in the Bathurst 24hr race last year, doing up to 350 laps before a scheduled change. In addition we have been running these discs in WRC, ARC, GTP, and V8 Brutes with excellent results.

We cop a bit of sh*t about our rotors cracking on the track every now and then, but you find they are street rotors that are not designed for this purpose. We have a growing range of premium product that aren't much more expensive than standard but can handle a bit of serious driving. During this year you may notice or hear more about DBA 4000 series (treated one piece) and the DBA 5000 series (treated two piece). Slotted or plain (GTP) only.

Slotted rotors are definitely more robust than drilled one's when it comes to hard driving. Drilled rotors do pull up quicker than any other street product though. Most of the observations I have made with EBC Reds have resulted in quite good performance but excessive wear on the pads and rotors. Your not going to get Ferodo performance out of these Reds or Bendix Ultimates. If you look at performance and pad/rotor life you'll find the DS2500's are cost effective.

Considering you popped a set of C/drilled rotors in two weeks, if you like you can contact me design@dba.com.au and we can do something for you...:D.... to keep you going until your ready for that brake upgrade.

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by FaTs
Steve,

.......................

Also are you planning on releasing DBA 5000's to fit a standard VT and would waiting for these be a better choice? Sorry for the questions but no-one around my area has a clue about brakes :mad:

Thanks



This brake clinic is here for you to ask as many questions as you like.

[F|sh]

steve how do i check if my master cylinder and vacum servo are fine?
i pulled one out of a car and i didnt check the brakes to see if they worked.

[dattoman1000]

Bring the booster to me at work fish and I'll test it on the vaccuum bench for you.
We can check the master for bypassing too if you bring that with you also.

[F|sh]

Neil u open tommorrow? im working on the coupe tommorrow so i could kill to birds with one stone

[dattoman1000]

Yep I'll be there between 9 and 12
but i can only test the booster but you can leave the master with me to get checked on monday

[F|sh]

hopefully we can make it there - im checking out a steel celica 5 speed tommorrow

[Bob Saget]

Just one more question :D Will rear rotors off a VN go onto a VR with IRS. I'd like to swap my old X-drilled from my VN to my VR drive car ?

Ta

[dbasteve]

Originally posted by FaTs
Just one more question :D Will rear rotors off a VN go onto a VR with IRS. I'd like to swap my old X-drilled from my VN to my VR drive car ?

Ta

No.
The VR with IRS rotor DBA 036 is 3mm higher than the DBA 016 VN rear. It will foul on the caliper bracket.

The non IRS VR and VN discs are the same.

[dk]

Hi Steve

How's progress on the DBA5000 two piece rotors for the jza80 tt Supra?

[Rollin]

hi steve.

i just fitted a set of drilled and slotted rotors (all round) to the XR the other week, and i have to say im VERY impressed - the pads i have at the moment are pathetic, with the stock discs they would fade so bad one hard stop from 100 and i couldnt even get the the ABS involved...(even with new 280C boiling point fluid) new rotors and now it will ABS stop from 100+ km/h - im very very impressed. the old rotors were mostly blue and had hairline cracks in them...straight to the bin i can tell you that! (had been ABUSING the hell out of them on purpose in the week leading up to getting the new rotors though.)

the actual point of this post (apart from to say thanks for making such great rotors) is to ask you what pads you think would be best when these one wear out?

i drive mostly on the street, i dont think i will ever use them to their full potential, but occasional quarter mile runs and a little hillclimb action will be on the menu soon - i dont think i am that hard on brakes (despite what i did to the old rotors! 135,000k on them though!) i always give them time to warm up and cool down too, if i use them hard... preferably a pad that wont chew the disc at a huge rate of knots as im not made of money...

thanks in advance!

[MAZMAN]

this technical brake clinic section is awsome :)

my question is:
1.the two piece rotor that you'se have mentioned...if you wear out the rotor part and need a replacement rotor and re-use the hub hat...will the rotor have run-out?

2.i have a 93 tt supra,and it has a 295mm front rotors.
the newer supras have 320mm(post 95 model)...do you make the two piece 320mm rotors for the supra and will that bolt on to the 93 model supra(i believe it should) and as long as the wheels are the right size?
also,is there any other benefit to the two piece then just having to buy the rotors alone,therefor being cheaper?

3.if these rotors are available,i would be very keen on getting a set for the front,what would the price be? or maybe you dont know? and then i would get the 4 spots that are from the post 95 model supra...would this be good enough for the street and some track work,or should i go bigger?

4.Do you'se also make two piece for the rears?(rotors).

5.pad recomedation would be appreciated for the setup i mentioned,and being used mostly on the streets.

thanks Steve for taking your time to answer every1's questions,much appreciated :) and your doing a excellent job.
cheers
Danny

[Bob Saget]

Originally posted by Rollin
hi steve.

i just fitted a set of drilled and slotted rotors (all round) to the XR the other week, and i have to say im VERY impressed - the pads i have at the moment are pathetic, with the stock discs they would fade so bad one hard stop from 100 and i couldnt even get the the ABS involved...(even with new 280C boiling point fluid) new rotors and now it will ABS stop from 100+ km/h - im very very impressed. the old rotors were mostly blue and had hairline cracks in them...straight to the bin i can tell you that! (had been ABUSING the hell out of them on purpose in the week leading up to getting the new rotors though.)

the actual point of this post (apart from to say thanks for making such great rotors) is to ask you what pads you think would be best when these one wear out?

i drive mostly on the street, i dont think i will ever use them to their full potential, but occasional quarter mile runs and a little hillclimb action will be on the menu soon - i dont think i am that hard on brakes (despite what i did to the old rotors! 135,000k on them though!) i always give them time to warm up and cool down too, if i use them hard... preferably a pad that wont chew the disc at a huge rate of knots as im not made of money...

thanks in advance!

Maybe go for a cheapish pad with good bit like bendix ultimates. They should be fine aslong as your not stopping from high speeds (150km/h+) repeatedly and not using them hard for stints of more than 10-15mins at a time. I did experince a fair bit of wear on my x-drilled dba's with ultimates (on a VN w/ VT calipers) but i did use (read:abuse) them very hard, well hard enough to crack a rotor 3/4 of the way through after 2months ;) without going near a racetrack. :D

[Rollin]

well i dont hammer them, but i do stop from high speeds (180km/h+ by the time i get to the braking area at willowbank) but thats leaving plenty of room to brake so im not trying hard to stop.

so the ultimates will be good and not wear the rotor much/at all if driven with a measure of sympathy?

[Trevor@BDA]

Look in some of the decent spare parts shops.
We have had to source longer studs (eg Holden and Ford) and found them by looking through a selection with helpful parts guys.
Regards
Trevor @ BDA

[Adrian128]

I have a question.

Does the direction of the slots have any effect (or bearing) on breaking performance? What I mean is that some slotted rotors have slots in one direction and other have it in another.. Kinda like putting DBA slotted rotors on the wrong sides of the car.

[dattoman1000]

I have seen them both ways
even from DBA
Its not entirely relevent on a street application
There are arguments one way or the other but I'm too tired to type them all

Take a look at the pic
(pic courtesy of DBA)

[indigoid]

... with borg warner rear end. currently it has the stocker 260mm discs, i want something smaller to allow fitting of 13" wheels.

thanks in advance,

j.

[Ramsey23]

Hi Steve,
I have a '94 series 6 RX-7, still with the stock 294mm rotors and 4-pot calipers up front. I'm building this car to be a good circuit racer as well as a street car and hence need some advice on brake modification. The car now has nearly 300kW of power at the wheels and weighs around 1250kg so stock brakes are certainly no longer adequate.
Wheel size is not an issue because they are 18 inches. I honestly know very little about brakes, and was browsing your catalogue and found the 2 piece HSV 343mm rotors with similar centre hole dimension of 71.5 (mazda is 72 i think). I 'm wondering if I can use these rotors.
Also, one other question, I believe changing the rotors makes the biggest difference when upgrading brakes, would the braking still be very good with the stock 4-pot calipers or should I change these at the same time.
Thanks in advance :)

[dattoman1000]

That 343mm commodore rotor is 32mm thick. Your calipers would take a 22mm disc approx. Best bet to go with this rotor is a 6 piston AP or larger F40 style 4 spot Brembo caliper.

If your going blacktrack racing this would be a good place to start.

[slug808]

just wanting to pick everyone's brains on what would be a good front brake upgrade for a te/tf gemini sedan as i'm planning an engine upgrade and would like to keep the same pcd if possible. Any suggestions ?

[dattoman1000]

Hopper Stoppers do a kit but its not listed on their site.
I'll try to find out about it.
Will require 15" wheels though

[slug808]

Dattoman, the car has 15"s on it now so no probs there.

[isuzu_gem]

im going to be doing a conversion on my gem as well but ill be using volvo callipers and tn magna rotors the only problem is that i was told that the rotors had to be machined down to 21mm so the volvo callipers fit but in doing that i will have to take off 1.5 mm off each side (original size is 24mm) is that safe? is there anyway to modify tha callipers so i donh have to machine the rotor at all? will it restrict the piston movement have less travel and be really toutchy?
help would be great

[dattoman1000]

The magna disc has enough meat on it to go to 21 but I wouldn't do it.
You can have 3mm thick spacers made to go between the caliper halves on the volvos. We use 6mm when we do some conversions on ours.

I'll get the info for you slug.

[isuzu_gem]

ok how hard is it to get them to seel propley isnt there some type of o ring thats in there? i was told to also ask you if it was legal to not use a master cylinder in a car that originally came out standard with one

[dattoman1000]

7x2mm or 9x2mm nitrile o-rings depending on the caliper.

I don't like boosters. In W.A. you don't have to have one if you can prove the car has sufficient brake pressure front and rear.
If you switch to a balance bar setup it must not be adjustable from the interior of the car.

[isuzu_gem]

thanks is a ballance bar the same as a bias valve?is there any sites that i could go to to read up on theroies about different types of set ups pros and cons? i know the basics like surface area leaverage
any more help would be great

[dattoman1000]

http://dsr.racer.net/brake_bias.htm
http://www.tiltonracing.com/brake/995/index.htm
http://www.stockcarproducts.com/tech1k.htm
http://www.bgdevelopments.co.uk/info/bar_tips.htm
http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/pdfs/103.pdf

That should either confuse you or make you a guru.

[isuzu_gem]

thanks mate now ive got many interesting hours of reading ahead of meil let you know how it goes

[747pilot]

Put new pads on my wife's 2001 Astra a couple of months ago- was very happy but they are now starting to squeal a hell of a lot under light braking and sometimes feel a bit "grabby" when cold.
The car does not get much hard use- except occasionally by me- as she drives it most of the time.
There is a slightly noticeable yellowish film on the rotors.
Pads are Bendix "Advance" .
How do I fix this problem- really appreciate any advice...?

[RichardM]

I've seen a kit at Commsport (http://www.commsport.com.au/prod226.htm) (http://www.commsport.com.au/prod226.htm) for Nissan R32 4 spot callipers on stock VX Commodore rotors.
Are these any improvment over stock VX?
How much by?
Opinions?
How about with DBA 4040 rotors?

[maximum.boost]

Hey Knowledgeable Brake People :-)

I'm looking to upgrade the brakes in my S14a 200sx in the next few months and just wanted to get some advice as to what i should be doing with my setup. I'll be running approximately 200+ KW's @ the wheels, so i'm going to need some decent stopping power without spending a fortune. I was thinking about moving the front rotor's and calipers to the rear and buying a new set of rotors and calipers for the front, i've already got bigger rims, so clearence shouldn't be a problem.

Any recommendations (DBA Crew)?

[TurboRA28]

What would you recommend for this problem?

It is a Toyota ST141 strut and hub, with a Nissan 4 spot alloy 30mm caliper.

Having trouble finding a rotor that fits as where the rotor bolts to the underside of the hub, already at or around the center of the caliper.

http://members.optusnet.com.au/helenfitz/caliper_height.jpg

Many thanks
Joel

[burtle]

Steve

I own a VS V8, i was thinking on getting some 4000 series rotors for the front (DBA:4035), my question to you is, because the rear discs are solid, there will be no rear 4000 series disc for the rear?, is the longlife rear slotted only available (DBA:36B), also is the hub on the longlife slotted rotor painted for rust protection and looks??....

Cheers

Robbo

[shinybluesteel]

good to see fastvp is planning on upgrading his brakes, now to make my car still be better than his in the braking department at least...

(sorry if you have covered this already)

could you recommed any ventilated discs that would be suitable for use in an australian delivered AE86 (solid stock discs)??]

or should i just do a proper brake conversion

[747pilot]

Ref previous problem with build up on front disks, squealing on my wife's Astra.
I fixed the problem very simply by
1. jacking up, removing wheels
2. running the engine in gear
3. sanding the disks as they spun with emery paper.

Now good as new, no squealing, grabbing etc and feel is great.
EASY :)