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Cordie
18-05-12, 02:11 PM
Is it to late to post this as a vehicle entrant?

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=171186506304292&set=a.168316973257912.39224.114910051931938&type=1&theater

big_pete
18-05-12, 02:25 PM
Sorry, yesterday was the cutoff

Skompa
18-05-12, 02:39 PM
I have this spare turbo.

Sketchy
18-05-12, 03:27 PM
As long as you actually plan to do something with it and not shitcunt out, then welcome aboard and I will be watching with interest. I have an unholy like for small shitbox hatches going much faster than they should.

Cordie
18-05-12, 08:38 PM
it will be unnecessarily loud and possibly fast with potential for catastrophic failure.
I am planning on keeping it N/A with some CBR900 carburetors.

I have Mr Anderson crunching the numbers for me, aiming for around 60hp at the wheels in a 470kg car. If this will not be sufficient I will then consider a power adder/s of some description.

I purchased the Suzuki for $500 about 4 years ago drove it for 6 months got rear ended by a truck and it has sat around ever since, trying to work out what its value would be so I can work out a build budget from there. Had a look about and there are a few ones for sale in good nick for about $500 (redbook values them at $900 go figure) .

so whats it worth? its got 160,000 on the clock a ding in the rear left quarter and will need a quarter cut to repair properly, its manual and the engine is ratshit and will need to be rebuilt or have a fresh motor replacement.

vet 180
18-05-12, 08:51 PM
no more than $200. Maybe $100 as you could argue its not worth more than scap metal.

If the engine needs to be rebuilt anyway this might be a good candidate for a heart transplant? Can the 1.3 from the charades fit?

nine2nine
18-05-12, 08:52 PM
In that condition im not sure if it has any value.

Tils
18-05-12, 09:02 PM
50 bucks. If that.

Cordie
18-05-12, 09:11 PM
Many engines will fit, I had toyed with the idea of coupling a 150hp mariner to the gearbox but decided that trying to stage and look around an outboard motor sticking out the bonnet was to much for me.

I have 2 F8b engines and 2 gearboxes, i have re bored one and purchased bearings gasket kit and pistons.
from memory the parts set me back nearly $250 I have 4 CBR900 carbs that i got of ebay for $112.

Justengt4
18-05-12, 09:18 PM
You would have to pay me to come and take kit away, it so i'd say you are $100 in credit at this stage ;)

Cordie
18-05-12, 09:26 PM
sweet, i will need every cent and a lot of luck to get the thing down the strip at 13.9. I really want to do it N/A and steer away from forced induction.

Skompa
18-05-12, 09:36 PM
Magna V6 and 44 gallon drum flares?

ALLMTR
18-05-12, 10:09 PM
Commodore V6 in tray running forward to a Sierra front diff...

BTW even at that weight you're going to need at least 100whp

OKE020
18-05-12, 11:30 PM
Ha ha I had one of these, it did 21s in the quarter ringing its neck.

Fondles
18-05-12, 11:44 PM
Many engines will fit, I had toyed with the idea of coupling a 150hp mariner to the gearbox but decided that trying to stage and look around an outboard motor sticking out the bonnet was to much for me.

.

This seriously needs to be done, if cunts can stage with 3ft of blower and hat poking through the bonnet the cowling on a Mariner 150hp will be no issue at all.

ls400x
19-05-12, 10:32 AM
Many engines will fit, I had toyed with the idea of coupling a 150hp mariner to the gearbox but decided that trying to stage and look around an outboard motor sticking out the bonnet was to much for me.

I have 2 F8b engines and 2 gearboxes, i have re bored one and purchased bearings gasket kit and pistons.
from memory the parts set me back nearly $250 I have 4 CBR900 carbs that i got of ebay for $112.

I'm going to take partial credit for the outboard engine conversion. I vaguely remember we discussed the potential muff and garden hose cooling system. Beers were involved

morerevsm3
19-05-12, 11:24 AM
put a complete CBR 900 motor in it and chain drive it

Rorz de Puniet
19-05-12, 11:29 AM
Road bike engine and gearbox?



edit: lol, beaten

Cordie
19-05-12, 12:05 PM
it was a joint effort luke and if i do it you can have pretty much all the credit :), have you crunched some numbers for me in the time vrs power department?

Cordie
19-05-12, 12:18 PM
ok so i did some maths and with 60hp at the treads in a 500kg car i will run a 12, sounds good on paper but will have to put it on the strip to test my maths

ALLMTR
19-05-12, 02:19 PM
Your maths is WAY wrong

OKE020
19-05-12, 03:17 PM
I can't see the pic but how did you pull 200kg + your own weight out of Suzuki 800, there is not a great deal in them to start with.

Skompa
19-05-12, 03:30 PM
https://fbcdn-photos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/s720x720/298299_171186506304292_114910051931938_335322_2974 62165_n.jpg

Cordie
19-05-12, 05:43 PM
been trying to find the owners manual I got, I am certain I read in it that the tare weight is 474 kg with a gvm of 850kg

ALLMTR
19-05-12, 05:54 PM
ok so i did some maths and with 60hp at the treads in a 500kg car i will run a 12, sounds good on paper but will have to put it on the strip to test my maths


been trying to find the owners manual I got, I am certain I read in it that the tare weight is 474 kg with a gvm of 850kg

So you weigh 26kg?

I;m not hating but want you to be aware you're going to need a lot more than 60whp to run 13's, let alone 12's. My old car was 1.5 x the weight of yours and needed 164whp to run a 12

Cordie
19-05-12, 06:10 PM
I weigh 80kg and even if the car comes in at 600kg once re assembled (I have car scales for the speedway/track cars) and I only have 60hp at the wheels i will still be in the competition without having to add boost



So you weigh 26kg?

I;m not hating but want you to be aware you're going to need a lot more than 60whp to run 13's, let alone 12's. My old car was 1.5 x the weight of yours and needed 164whp to run a 12

Monk
19-05-12, 07:33 PM
https://fbcdn-photos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/s720x720/298299_171186506304292_114910051931938_335322_2974 62165_n.jpg

Stripping weight out of it by removing the engine doesn't make it go faster...

lowlai
19-05-12, 08:23 PM
in this case it might

Cordie
19-05-12, 11:34 PM
this is true


Stripping weight out of it by removing the engine doesn't make it go faster...

Skompa
19-05-12, 11:39 PM
That's just to make room for the horse to pull it along.

vet 180
20-05-12, 03:31 AM
I am still thinking you should give up on the f8b idea

is $200 for the rebuild, plus 100 or so for the cbr carbs

That $300 could be spent on a new charade or swift front half cut. I am sure there are a few crashed at pickles or some crap.

You can do the 13 na.....just with the f8b I am not so sure without spending big.

I am really liking the idea of a the lightweight car for the challenge just drop a better engine in

MRMOPARMAN
21-05-12, 07:36 PM
chuck a 4age in it.. they are capable of a 15.9s stock in a car 1.5x the charades weight.

Guido
21-05-12, 08:38 PM
The kerb wait of an 800 hatch is 600kgs + your weight + the bigger motor, transaxle, wheels and tyres. Baring in mind there is nothing much to strip out of these you'd be doing very well to get it under 650kgs race weight.

millsi
22-05-12, 08:26 PM
i have a complete cbr1000 engine ;)

Cordie
22-05-12, 09:10 PM
so the official kerb weight of a suzuki hatch 800 is 600kg (weight of car without driver with all fluid reservoirs full including vehicle accessories), so with weight reduction and me sitting in it we will work on a total weight of 600kg. This is obviously subject to change as the build completes and i put it on the scales.

I am happy for the following rough calculation to be corrected but with a power to weight ratio of 1hp to every 10kg my little shit box should run a 12 sec pass, obviously there are other factors to think of such as drag co efficiency, traction and the fact that the current gear ratio inside my box of gears will only hurtle the car to a maximum speed of 140kmph. Not that i expect to achieve a top speed of 140km.

I will post pictures shortly of the bottom end progress, I am not sure if i will use the pistons i have bought yet. I am going to browse the weisco catalog and see if i can find a roadbike piston that will fit. I am not sure that balancing is a budget friendly option but it will be investigated none the less.

Cordie
22-05-12, 09:14 PM
just seen your post, i googled the question relentlessly until i found the data and yes 650kg is probably a bit more realistic but there is still a fair amount of unnecessary stuff in a hatch 800......... :/ like the plastic dash board that weighs about 500 grams......

ALLMTR
22-05-12, 09:14 PM
There are 11ty billion things wrong with your calcs. You need at least 170kmh to run a 12. Where are you getting this 1hp per 10kg stuff from??? Do you think a 1500kg Falcon will run 12's with 150hp?

Edit: Nash, is this you?

Skompa
22-05-12, 09:15 PM
Shit the bluebird will run 9's if those calculations are correct.

I still reckon you get the biggest budget motor you can afford and weld the whole front end in.

Cordie
22-05-12, 09:19 PM
it would definitely be a sensible option, but will provide me with less challenges. I am hoping to apply some of my r and d into thermal efficiency in order to achieve more than 60bhp.

Cordie
22-05-12, 09:22 PM
if the 150hp was used correctly and to its full potential then its possably divide 600 by 60 and you get 10. maths give me a power to weight ratio of 10 to 1

ALLMTR
22-05-12, 09:24 PM
Haha, good one, Nash

Cordie
22-05-12, 09:25 PM
what are you expecting at the wheels in the hp department?? and there are some serious forces to overcome in order bring a car down under the 11 second mark.

ALLMTR
22-05-12, 09:35 PM
Sheldon????

Cordie
22-05-12, 09:38 PM
I am still waiting for feedback from Mr Anderson in the advanced maths department, actual physics and backyard guesslications are two completely different things. there is absolutely no reason why a car with a speed of 120kmph as it passes the beam cannot run a 12 second q/m. it really depends on how quickly the car was able to accelerate its total mass. The 60 foot time a car clocks will give you a very good indication as to the time it will run. Similarly an engine that develops 100hp compared to a identical engine that has been balanced will still only make 100hp it will just do it a shit load quicker.

Skompa
22-05-12, 09:46 PM
According to many interwebs guestimation quarter calculators, a 600kg car with 60bhp will run a 16 second pass.

Cordie
22-05-12, 09:51 PM
https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/290526_172359816186961_114910051931938_338667_8536 7390_o.jpg

Cordie
22-05-12, 09:53 PM
hmmm, still waiting on Mr Anderson to give me the correct calculations he is a very busy man

Tils
22-05-12, 10:03 PM
He can't speak atm. He has no mouth.

Cordie
22-05-12, 10:10 PM
if i need 120bhp i will need a power adder or some insanely big cam and a lot of cylinder head work with some extreme bottom end balancing. I believe to achieve 80 hp i will need 100% volumetric efficiency at 12% thermal efficiency making full use of the 800cc, i could consider an extremely effective air ram to bump up my volumetric efficiency a few %. there are also ways to increase output by limiting thermal transfer during the combustion process but that a little to NASA spec for this competition

Skompa
22-05-12, 10:13 PM
Or cheaper bigger motor and MIG?

Cordie
22-05-12, 10:14 PM
or he is up to his nuts in guts... the sly dog

Tils
22-05-12, 10:15 PM
Alternatively you could push it off a tall building to achieve the desired end result.

Cordie
22-05-12, 10:20 PM
the mig I have, I also have a forged 4g6e, gearbox and k frame at my disposal but it may exceed the budget by a few grand

I could also interpret the rules to say that the vehicle platform only has to be front wheel drive and further interpret the rules to say that placing the front end of a ford probe in the bum of my hatch as permissible. Of course this would mean that my car has been probed in the ass but I would have plenty of hp and the bonus of rwd for traction

Cordie
22-05-12, 10:22 PM
but would not give me the same level of satisfaction or a massive shit eating grin if i manage to run a 12

Tils
22-05-12, 10:42 PM
Too much derp. Roger cordial has visited us like a 28th day nemesis.

Cordie
22-05-12, 10:45 PM
i had a DT once with too much derp, needed a power pipe, very agricultural

ALLMTR
22-05-12, 11:08 PM
Shame really. I would have liked to seen a little Zuk as a competitor

OKE020
22-05-12, 11:42 PM
Lol wtf is going on

crack
23-05-12, 09:11 AM
Do you believe that my engine being stronger or faster has anything to do with VE or thermal efficiency? Do you think that's air you're breathing now?

nine2nine
23-05-12, 09:55 AM
You are absolutely correct, you only need to average 120km/h to run a 12.09. You also only need to average 104km/h to run a 13.9. Given any though as to how your hatch is going to take off at 120km/h?

I might also add that those calculators are based on average power applied during the run. Which depending on setup average power can often be a fair percentage below peak power.

Unfortunately its become fairly clear that this either wont happen, or will run an impressive 16 sec as stated above.

Skompa
23-05-12, 10:07 AM
I'd love to see it pull a 13 but I'm very sceptical that the na 3cyl will get there. For two tenths of fuck all you could pick up a fwd 4 banger with plenty of aftermarket go fast bits. Ca18de or Sr20de out of an exa/pulsar are always for sale in the 100 to 300 bracket. Hell a lot of ca's are free. That or a bike engine and a chain drive.

Rona
23-05-12, 11:14 AM
I'd love to see it pull a 13 but I'm very sceptical that the na 3cyl will get there. For two tenths of fuck all you could pick up a fwd 4 banger with plenty of aftermarket go fast bits. Ca18de or Sr20de out of an exa/pulsar are always for sale in the 100 to 300 bracket. Hell a lot of ca's are free. That or a bike engine and a chain drive.
A mates turbo Mira only did 15.9 with basic mods so I doubt an NA will get anywhere near the time unless big $$$ were spent. Had shitty cheese cutters on it so wheel spun pretty badly but it was a 15 flat car at best.

Spoonfed
24-05-12, 10:48 AM
i have a complete cbr1000 engine ;)

See I told you this sort of thing was a good idea for said engine!

Rorz de Puniet
24-05-12, 01:18 PM
so the official kerb weight of a suzuki hatch 800 is 600kg (weight of car without driver with all fluid reservoirs full including vehicle accessories), so with weight reduction and me sitting in it we will work on a total weight of 600kg. This is obviously subject to change as the build completes and i put it on the scales.

I am happy for the following rough calculation to be corrected but with a power to weight ratio of 1hp to every 10kg my little shit box should run a 12 sec pass, obviously there are other factors to think of such as drag co efficiency, traction and the fact that the current gear ratio inside my box of gears will only hurtle the car to a maximum speed of 140kmph. Not that i expect to achieve a top speed of 140km.



Ummm, no.


A Suzuki SV650 weighs 189kg with fluids and has 64hp. With a half decent rider they'll do 12 second passes.

A 600kg car with 60-odd horsepower isn't going to get anywhere near a 12 second pass based on power to weight alone but then you also have the fact the bike does 0-100km/h in well under 4 seconds which your car is never going to do.

Get a bike engine and gearbox with 150hp+ and you might have a chance.

stockymcstock
24-05-12, 01:21 PM
yeah there's some seriously retarded maths going on here.

To give you an indication - I have a 1050kg car, it's front wheel drive. Using a tight LSD box and very sticky tyres (KUMHO KU36) on a sticky track on a cold night I managed to run a 13.4 with 200fwkw, that's about 350-380hp at the engine (maybe more). 60 foot time was shithouse at 2.3 seconds.

In summary, you have no chance of running a 13 with less than 200hp at the engine

edit: MPH was 110.8 so it was honking when it crossed the line at 180km/h

ALLMTR
24-05-12, 02:12 PM
:dontfeedthetroll:

CA18escort
24-05-12, 02:58 PM
Concur i have a mighty boy with a ga10 993cc engine that is lighter than the hatch and with 60hp it would be lucky to crack a 17 sec 1/4 mile

Cordie
24-05-12, 10:52 PM
hey its my dead horse and i will flog it as much as I want :)

Cordie
24-05-12, 10:55 PM
i have found a banged up mighty boy that I wont feel so bad about molesting with ill fitting k frames and motors that will not allow a bonnet to close

ALLMTR
24-05-12, 10:59 PM
Can't wait to see the progress....

Cordie
24-05-12, 11:25 PM
pretty sure i will still get the zuke to run a 12 with 70hp at the wheels and stay on budget :)

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/578085_296725843750357_114910051931938_647882_1237 150709_n.jpg

Cordie
24-05-12, 11:28 PM
people may not let me on the track but

Gammaboy
25-05-12, 06:31 AM
pretty sure i will still get the zuke to run a 12 with 70hp at the wheels and stay on budget :)

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/578085_296725843750357_114910051931938_647882_1237 150709_n.jpg

1/8 mile?

Rorz de Puniet
25-05-12, 07:48 AM
hey its my dead horse and i will flog it as much as I want :)


I don't think that horse is the only thing you're flogging.

Cordie
25-05-12, 07:28 PM
no doubt mate

Cordie
25-05-12, 08:11 PM
do you know what it is?


1/8 mile?

Cordie
25-05-12, 11:16 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4YXFE9ypm5w&feature=player_detailpage&list=FL6GFEUBlUurUymbVHFadOlQ

Cordie
27-05-12, 08:02 PM
got the molestable Hatch 800 now all i need is the front half of a v6 magna.



https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4020442599182&set=a.1714057060985.2096212.1524935197&type=1&ref=nf

Cordie
27-05-12, 08:07 PM
https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/s320x320/550595_4020442599182_1524935197_3355307_1127579481 _n.jpg

Cordie
27-05-12, 08:10 PM
should be a perfect showcase of my skills with a gas axe and mig as opposed to a showcase of my skills as a mechanic with an inability to understand the words cant or wont.

Two of the dirtiest 4 letter words in the English dictionary

Jim
27-05-12, 08:55 PM
Have you done anything yet or just collected shit?

Cordie
27-05-12, 09:10 PM
i do something every day, tomorrow I will measure my total deck height so I know how much to linish of my head to give me a compression ratio of 10 to 1 or close enough to. I might even go see Mr Black and check how he is going with my head and tell him what I have found thus far. Hopefully we can round up some heavy springs, bigger valves and seats on the cheap. If you watch the video i posted you will see that I have balanced my rods and pistons, I went to put them in today but the bloke who machined my block and provided me with the pistons and rings left out all my snap rings and one oil ring.

Cordie
27-05-12, 10:13 PM
I also helped my mate finish his Jim Mock devcon 5 4.0 today after 6 years of it sitting in the shed, all going well we will be running it in by the end of the week if he gets rego on it


https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/318249_4019311330901_1391302059_n.jpg

Rorz de Puniet
04-06-12, 12:00 AM
I like the rust on the wipers. Stylish yet tough and unrefined.

I'm DJ!
04-06-12, 09:46 AM
Ratrod ftw yo

Cordie
04-06-12, 10:16 PM
I doubt they will affect the vehicle performance

Cordie
04-06-12, 10:18 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyGP8VbLQPI&feature=player_detailpage

Rorz de Puniet
08-06-12, 04:00 PM
LOL at an engine that small that doesn't have 4 valves per cylinder. I guess the best thing about that engine is you're taking it to the dump, yeah? Cause if you aren't, you should. Just sayin'.

Jim
08-06-12, 04:03 PM
I doubt they will affect the vehicle performance

Pretty sure we would all agree with that :)

Jim
08-06-12, 04:11 PM
ok, to do a 13.99 and assuming you weigh 70kg and you can shed 20kg out of this thing, you will need this engine to produce 100kW at the flywheel.
It's possible I guess, but I suspect it's a big ask of the 3cyl. You may get there with some big revs but I doubt it'd have enough torque to get the decent 60' you'll need.
Will watch with interest. :)

Tils
08-06-12, 04:41 PM
The drugs are strong with this one...

Lonx
08-06-12, 04:49 PM
http://www.ozmufc.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/bigkev.jpg

Jim
08-06-12, 05:04 PM
Well, he's working on it and doing some sort of progress, which is more than most of the detractors here ever managed, so don't be a dick. Half the original challengers didn't even get this far.

Cordie
08-06-12, 06:52 PM
i will strap a rocket to the roof if i have to

Cordie
08-06-12, 06:57 PM
I wont be taking it to the dump and I certainly do no chip away at my Iq level with drugs.

ALLMTR
08-06-12, 07:13 PM
Well, he's working on it and doing some sort of progress, which is more than most of the detractors here ever managed, so don't be a dick. Half the original challengers didn't even get this far.

Yep and if he ever gets it to a drag strip, he's in for a hell of a shock....

kneelo
08-06-12, 09:41 PM
great stuff...love the little 3 bangers, but have to agree I don't think its a chance of being a contender for 13's... I'd start looking for that rocket.

ls400x
09-06-12, 12:28 PM
Let me know when you're working on it Cordie and I'll give you a hand

Cordie
13-06-12, 07:42 AM
thanks luke, will see how i go this week with the head and the missing snap lock rings and oil ring. I remember many years ago a bloke brought his "sic" gallant with the "worlds fastest" 265 hemi in it out to the tuan forestry to race bradly in his clubsport. Brad told him he had to beat me in my 250cf xc before he would race him. this bloke much like the other delusional wankers on this forum laughed thinking that because his car had a big wanky cam 3 carbys and a really loud exhaust he would smoke me. my xc had all back yard mods (suspension and a drilled out secondary jet plus a few little other tricks). needless to say he loaded his gallant back on to the tilt tray and went home. That was 8 years ago, more recently I had a fellow Army mechanic bagging out my "shitbox" turbo Xg ute. It was pretty shit boxy and the total build cost came to 5g including purchase of the ute. This bloke was pulling his dick and telling me that I had no chance up against his 32gtr (another worlds fastest) needless to say I made him look like a total fuckwit also. So fuckwits if you have nothing positive to say then please kindly return to beating of over your "worlds fastest" checkbook racer car.

Gammaboy
13-06-12, 07:50 AM
Best troll ever.

Dave
13-06-12, 09:31 AM
I just want to be in this thread

Jim
13-06-12, 10:36 AM
This thread needs a hug.
Hurry up and finish it and prove the haters wrong. :)

Skompa
13-06-12, 10:47 AM
Magna v6 and 44 gallon drum flares is still my vote.

I am curious to see what the na 3cyl pulls though.

GTREA
13-06-12, 11:06 AM
This Suzuki will have no chance up against my 32gtr

ALLMTR
13-06-12, 02:19 PM
This Suzuki will have no chance up against my 32gtr

Checkbook racer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111

jimmyg
13-06-12, 05:40 PM
Can the peanut gallery stop clogging up the thread please. :confused:

13's or not happy to see a 1300for$1300 car underway. :)

Cordie
13-06-12, 07:36 PM
bam


Checkbook racer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11111

Jim
11-07-12, 10:04 PM
*cough*

ALLMTR
11-07-12, 11:54 PM
I am still waiting for feedback from Mr Anderson in the advanced maths department, actual physics and backyard guesslications are two completely different things. there is absolutely no reason why a car with a speed of 120kmph as it passes the beam cannot run a 12 second q/m. it really depends on how quickly the car was able to accelerate its total mass. The 60 foot time a car clocks will give you a very good indication as to the time it will run. Similarly an engine that develops 100hp compared to a identical engine that has been balanced will still only make 100hp it will just do it a shit load quicker.

I think he is still waiting for Mr Anderson to get back to him

MRMOPARMAN
12-07-12, 12:04 PM
Didnt mr anderson die in episode 3?

ALLMTR
12-07-12, 02:43 PM
there is absolutely no reason why a car with a speed of 120kmph as it passes the beam cannot run a 12 second q/m.

By the by, I'm no Mr Anderson from the advanced maths department but my basic math understanding is that the only way you can run a 12 second 1/4 going through the finish beam at 120kph is if you also go through the start beam at that speed...

MexicanBatman
13-07-12, 12:02 PM
I've seen it happen, top fuel practice launches then rolled the whole track, but they probably still get up to 130mph before 100ft, could be close LOL

Cordie
13-07-12, 06:58 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fOo8FmQDpHc&feature=player_detailpage

ALLMTR
13-07-12, 07:58 PM
Holy fuck!!!!!

It's been ten minutes and I literally cannot stop laughing, thanks heaps

jimmyg
13-07-12, 09:22 PM
Update at last! Thought you had given up.

Cordie
22-07-12, 12:16 PM
nah not a chance my friend, having to much fun stirring up some of the clowns that frequent this thread :)

sideways
25-07-12, 02:22 AM
80hp ATW out of a N/A carby 2v F motor? Not to mention for under $1300?

Just to give you an Idea of how unrealistic that is, the current model Barina Spark has a long lost descendant of the F motor, it's a 1.2l 16v DOHC 4 cyl.

It makes 83HP at 6000rpm.

Happy to eat my own words, drive to your place(in my F10a powered Suzuki), give you a certificate of my apology and pay you to make my motor perform as such if you can do it of course.

Thanks

Clown

ls400x
26-07-12, 01:05 PM
Updates?

Cordie
28-07-12, 02:02 PM
yet 105hp out of a 600cc road bike engine is achievable

go figure

Cordie
28-07-12, 02:11 PM
Updates?

Have had some good results on the flow bench with the first port, 83cfm at 400 thou lift but wont flow past there probably due to me being overly excessive with material removal on the short side of the port. Have a cam coming from crow with 8thou lift so hopefully the next port will make full use of the cams capability. Trent is going to build up around the top of the ports for me to have more room to move up and and ramp the inlet ports. Basically just trial and error atm, paul wants to have a chop at a port design as well.

Gammaboy
28-07-12, 02:14 PM
Lulzor. 600cc bike engines are turning 12000+ rpm to make those numbers - the head architecture is a world away from the heap of shit you're working with. Put down the crack pipe dude.

Cordie
28-07-12, 05:46 PM
Lulzor. 600cc bike engines are turning 12000+ rpm to make those numbers - the head architecture is a world away from the heap of shit you're working with. Put down the crack pipe dude.

your not wrong about the head architecture and I am working with a mass produced engine designed for a keata class Japanese car. I love all the comments from the self appointed subject matter "experts" on this thread as I find the level of ignorance and arrogance from some quite amusing.

Make sure you all turn up when i put it on the strip so you can all laugh at me :)

ALLMTR
28-07-12, 06:24 PM
your not wrong about the head architecture and I am working with a mass produced engine designed for a keata class Japanese car. I love all the comments from the self appointed subject matter "experts" on this thread as I find the level of ignorance and arrogance from some quite amusing.

Make sure you all turn up when i put it on the strip so you can all laugh at me :)

Well, I've run 12's in a NA FWD. In fact, I was the first person in the country to do it....ten years ago. Not bragging just explaining the background to my "expert" status. I know what it takes, you don't.

I'll laugh at you from afar, thanks

irsa76
28-07-12, 06:41 PM
Good on you for having a go. But maybe pull your head out of your arse for a second and actually think about what these guys are saying. Comparing a >700cc motorbike engine which is designed purely for performance too a >700cc car engine where the design brief was to use the least fuel possible is either misguided or simply deluded. The fact the manufacturers resorted to multi valve heads and forced induction, even twin charging, to get the same goal HP that you want should tell you something.

Cordie
28-07-12, 06:55 PM
70/80bhp out of an 800 cc engine is not unachievable, i listen to lots of people and can very quickly work out if they are dribbling shit or worth my time. When did i compare a multi valve roadbike engine to a single cam car engine? like i said i love all the "experts" telling me what will and wont work. I am aiming for 80 hp and if i don't get it well fuck me I had a chop at it. All you tossers getting on here telling me I wont or cant do what I am trying to do need to chill the fuck out and find a hobby or get a girlfriend. So in summary fuck you and fuck the lot of ya

Cordie
28-07-12, 06:57 PM
Well, I've run 12's in a NA FWD. In fact, I was the first person in the country to do it....ten years ago. Not bragging just explaining the background to my "expert" status. I know what it takes, you don't.

I'll laugh at you from afar, thanks
well good for you champ I am sure everyone was really proud of you and gave you a big old pat on the back, I think your full of shit but please prove me wrong :)

Tils
28-07-12, 07:17 PM
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6mff2Z7s51ranhnao1_500.gif

sideways
28-07-12, 11:40 PM
yet 105hp out of a 600cc road bike engine is achievable

go figure

Lets compare apples to Mexican fighting fish?

Jim
29-07-12, 07:05 AM
Let him finish the project guys.
I want to at least see it run.

ls400x
29-07-12, 07:36 AM
I agree. I remember reading a fast 4s article back in the day trying to get 100hp/L at the flywheel out of a sohc 2L escort engine. I think they almost made it with a lot of testing different cams on an engine dyno. Comp ratio was something like 11:1 and had side draft webers.

Cordie
29-07-12, 01:48 PM
Well, I've run 12's in a NA FWD. In fact, I was the first person in the country to do it....ten years ago. Not bragging just explaining the background to my "expert" status. I know what it takes, you don't.

I'll laugh at you from afar, thanks
you come across as one of those tossers that hang around guys like me that are trying to push the boundary of what is possible then go sit down the pub and talk about the shit like its your idea and your the expert. Then 10 years later still having achieved nothing or gone anywhere in life frequent a forum and post on threads like you actually know what your talking about. I believe you may have been aloud to put a sticker on it or polished the wheels but build it pffff get your hand of it fuckwit.

Cordie
29-07-12, 02:03 PM
to the other pin dick "experts" on this thread telling me I am trying to compare a f8b to a r6 engine I will educate you a little. A standard r6 engine flows twice as much as my head flows at 800thou lift with half the valve travel. I have an inlet port with a almost 90 degree turn in it were the r6 inlet port has around a 20 degree turn in it. I have a one cam and 2 valves per cylinder were the r6 has 2 cams and 4 valves per cylinder. To use the cam I am hoping will work in my engine I will be using ls1 valve springs with 150 foot-pound of tension holding the valve closed as apposed to the standard spring having 25 foot-pound. At 800 thou lift the ls1 spring has 450 foot-pound of spring tension were the standard spring has bottomed out at 75 foot-pound. the most likely scenario will be the timing belt will snap and or the valve guides will tear through whats left of my inlet ports. Not to mention the fact that I am still running the factory rods and $14 pistons to keep the build cost down. I have "hand balanced" everything including the flywheel that was turned down on a lathe. I am fortunate enough to have access to a $8000 flow bench that belongs to one of the real experts I know. Putting it together for $1200 and achieving the power I am chasing is to most dim wits a pipe dream. Make sure you all turn up to watch I would hate to think you will miss out on the opportunity to point and laugh at somebody trying to achieve something considered unachievable.

Billzilla
29-07-12, 02:12 PM
Okay.

Fondles
29-07-12, 02:16 PM
to the other pin dick "experts" on this thread telling me I am trying to compare a f8b to a r6 engine I will educate you a little. A standard r6 engine flows twice as much as my head flows at 800thou lift with half the valve travel. I have an inlet port with a almost 90 degree turn in it were the r6 inlet port has around a 20 degree turn in it. I have a one cam and 2 valves per cylinder were the r6 has 2 cams and 4 valves per cylinder. To use the cam I am hoping will work in my engine I will be using ls1 valve springs with 150 foot-pound of tension holding the valve closed as apposed to the standard spring having 25 foot-pound. At 800 thou lift the ls1 spring has 450 foot-pound of spring tension were the standard spring has bottomed out at 75 foot-pound. the most likely scenario will be the timing belt will snap and or the valve guides will tear through whats left of my inlet ports. Not to mention the fact that I am still running the factory rods and $14 pistons to keep the build cost down. I have "hand balanced" everything including the flywheel that was turned down on a lathe. I am fortunate enough to have access to a $8000 flow bench that belongs to one of the real experts I know. Putting it together for $1200 and achieving the power I am chasing is to most dim wits a pipe dream. Make sure you all turn up to watch I would hate to think you will miss out on the opportunity to point and laugh at somebody trying to achieve something considered unachievable.

Wat ?

Cordie
29-07-12, 02:35 PM
what don't you understand?

Billzilla
29-07-12, 02:44 PM
what don't you understand?

The public fascination in reality TV programmes.
I just don't get it.

Fondles
29-07-12, 02:44 PM
what don't you understand?

Your Unintelligible waffling, hit the enter button occasionally.

<---cop
29-07-12, 02:51 PM
what don't you understand?

Has anyone really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?

Cordie
29-07-12, 02:53 PM
Your Unintelligible waffling, hit the enter button occasionally.
gee sorry mate hope I didn't ruin your day

Cordie
29-07-12, 02:54 PM
The public fascination in reality TV programmes.
I just don't get it.
simple things amuse simple people

floody
29-07-12, 03:01 PM
So what are the flow numbers on your expert friend's flowbench after all that head work?

Hope you're not being held up too much by all the tossers hanging around to get your ideas for the pub, be great to see this finished.

Cordie
29-07-12, 03:02 PM
So what are the flow numbers on your expert friend's flowbench after all that head work?

Hope you're not being held up too much by all the tossers hanging around to get your ideas for the pub, be great to see this finished.

recon I will be lucky to get 100cfm

ALLMTR
29-07-12, 03:32 PM
you come across as one of those tossers that hang around guys like me that are trying to push the boundary of what is possible then go sit down the pub and talk about the shit like its your idea and your the expert. Then 10 years later still having achieved nothing or gone anywhere in life frequent a forum and post on threads like you actually know what your talking about. I believe you may have been aloud to put a sticker on it or polished the wheels but build it pffff get your hand of it fuckwit.

Ha! I'm nothing like the guys that hang around you. On my car, I built the motor incl machining, rebuilt the gearbox, rewired the car, designed and built the extractors, designed and built the entire chrome moly rear end, modified the motor to take a VTEC head, fitted the motor and box with mounts I made and then I fitted the stickers....actually no stickers were fitted.

As far as life, I own my own new homestead house on an acre block in a beautiful part of the country, own a quick Xr6t ute, am building my dream kit car, have a loving wife and two beautiful kids. I don't owe a cent and I've retired with enough money to live the life at the age of 46. Thanks for your concern.

I hope you finish it, good luck

BTW, this is my mate's patting me on the back :)

http://performanceforums.com/forums/showthread.php?67157034-ALLMTR-into-the-twelves!&highlight=

Cordie
29-07-12, 03:41 PM
Ha! I'm nothing like the guys that hang around you. On my car, I built the motor incl machining, rebuilt the gearbox, rewired the car, designed and built the extractors, designed and built the entire chrome moly rear end, modified the motor to take a VTEC head, fitted the motor and box with mounts I made and then I fitted the stickers....actually no stickers were fitted.

As far as life, I own my own new homestead house on an acre block in a beautiful part of the country, own a quick Xr6t ute, am building my dream kit car, have a loving wife and two beautiful kids. I don't owe a cent and I've retired with enough money to live the life at the age of 46. Thanks for your concern.

I hope you finish it, good luck


I stand corrected, anything honda is a good place to start. I am sure there were plenty of people telling you it couldn't be done. I hope you told them all to fuck off

MexicanBatman
29-07-12, 05:37 PM
You should enter the gymnastics in the Olympics, cos that was a decent backflip LOL

Cordie
29-07-12, 06:29 PM
You should enter the gymnastics in the Olympics, cos that was a decent backflip LOL

nothing wrong with being wrong

Babalouie
29-07-12, 07:03 PM
You should enter the gymnastics in the Olympics, cos that was a decent backflip LOL

Golfclap.

jimmyg
30-07-12, 11:37 AM
Stop being pulled into keyboard shit fights and build the car farkin. :)

Fondles
30-07-12, 11:44 AM
Stop being pulled into keyboard shit fights and build the car farkin. :)

You takin zero notice of what he/she is doing, this shit pile aint going anywhere.

BigMuz
30-07-12, 12:25 PM
nothing wrong with being wrong

Indeed. You're nailing it.

PS porting isn't going to turn 70 into 200.

Shifty
30-07-12, 03:38 PM
This thread is a riot :)

Out of interest I went googling.

http://www.suzukituning.com/SuzukiTuning/AltoTuning/SuzukiAltoTuning.htm

stockymcstock
30-07-12, 04:04 PM
I'm not sure what your point is cordie - on the one hand you're telling us that the whole thing is crap, the radius on the turns shocking, the ports are tiny and the mechanicals of the valvetrain are pathetic, but on the other hand you're blindly telling us it will make good power and run awesome times. You say " Putting it together for $1200 and achieving the power I am chasing is to most dim wits a pipe dream." even though there are about 10 people in this thread with the mechanical knowledge to know that this is, in fact, a pipe dream of yours. not to mention the mathematics behind the power and times you're trying to run is way off..... it's kinda weird watching you do this because none of it makes any sense? Do you have some type of psychological condition that we don't know about? Cause I don't wanna make fun of someone with "issues"

Gammaboy
30-07-12, 04:10 PM
Cordie. Short for Cordia. Roger, is that you?

Babalouie
30-07-12, 04:30 PM
Cordie. Short for Cordia. Roger, is that you?

Oh. SNAP.

Fraud
30-07-12, 04:47 PM
I'd assumed all along that this was an AI for a regular user with a workshop who was just being a very dedicated troll..

Karnage
30-07-12, 04:55 PM
to the other pin dick "experts" on this thread telling me I am trying to compare a f8b to a r6 engine I will educate you a little. A standard r6 engine flows twice as much as my head flows at 800thou lift with half the valve travel. I have an inlet port with a almost 90 degree turn in it were the r6 inlet port has around a 20 degree turn in it. I have a one cam and 2 valves per cylinder were the r6 has 2 cams and 4 valves per cylinder. To use the cam I am hoping will work in my engine I will be using ls1 valve springs with 150 foot-pound of tension holding the valve closed as apposed to the standard spring having 25 foot-pound. At 800 thou lift the ls1 spring has 450 foot-pound of spring tension were the standard spring has bottomed out at 75 foot-pound. the most likely scenario will be the timing belt will snap and or the valve guides will tear through whats left of my inlet ports. Not to mention the fact that I am still running the factory rods and $14 pistons to keep the build cost down. I have "hand balanced" everything including the flywheel that was turned down on a lathe. I am fortunate enough to have access to a $8000 flow bench that belongs to one of the real experts I know. Putting it together for $1200 and achieving the power I am chasing is to most dim wits a pipe dream. Make sure you all turn up to watch I would hate to think you will miss out on the opportunity to point and laugh at somebody trying to achieve something considered unachievable.

Interesting, Have you got any theories on winning lotto?

BigMuz
30-07-12, 05:26 PM
Oh god dammit.

stockymcstock
30-07-12, 06:47 PM
Cordie. Short for Cordia. Roger, is that you?

how did i not see this before

Gammaboy
30-07-12, 06:51 PM
how did i not see this before

I didn't twig untill you mentioned making fun of people with issues!

RNS-11Z
30-07-12, 06:53 PM
I was thinking the other night is this roger lol some one beat me to it

darwinschops
30-07-12, 07:03 PM
I thought this was roger. He did have Autism.

Cordie
30-07-12, 07:07 PM
80 bhp, 600kg car

Cordie
30-07-12, 07:08 PM
I have been trade qualified for 6 years I am yet to read a post on hear from a real mechanic, once again feel free to correct me if I am wrong

BigMuz
30-07-12, 07:19 PM
Are you a fucking idiot?

Making big ports is not going to make the difference you think it is.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fOo8FmQDpHc&amp;feature=player_embedded#!

BigMuz
30-07-12, 07:21 PM
It's not roger either.

That won't make 80 horsepower at the wheels without a turbo. Those ports are shit and it would need to be double it's capacity or double the rpm for them to help at all.

Lots of qualified mechanics are retards so I wouldn't brag about that so much.

Jim
30-07-12, 07:22 PM
I have been trade qualified for 6 years I am yet to read a post on hear from a real mechanic, once again feel free to correct me if I am wrong

consider youself corrected at least three times that I know of. HTH

BigMuz
30-07-12, 07:23 PM
Fuck me. Linishing the top of the piston to equalize deck height.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4YXFE9ypm5w&amp;feature=relmfu

ALLMTR
30-07-12, 07:27 PM
Did I forget to mention I am a fully qualified mechanic completing my apprenticeship with City Ford in 1985

MRMOPARMAN
30-07-12, 07:28 PM
It's not roger either.

That won't make 80 horsepower at the wheels without a turbo. Those ports are shit and it would need to be double it's capacity or double the rpm for them to help at all.

Lots of qualified mechanics are retards so I wouldn't brag about that so much.

that wont make the power with a turbo either unless he o'rings the intake ports as well. id doubt a gasket would seal with that little meat left.

+4 mechanics in thread.

BigMuz
30-07-12, 07:29 PM
Lol eyeing off the overlap using vice grips. 1 degree.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&amp;NR=1&amp;v=IyGP8VbLQPI

Jim
30-07-12, 07:34 PM
Lots of qualified mechanics are retards so I wouldn't brag about that so much.


Did I forget to mention I am a fully qualified mechanic completing my apprenticeship with City Ford in 1985



+4 mechanics in thread.


bad timing is bad :lol:

(PS I got my mechanic's ticket at a Brookvale engine shop in '91)

MRMOPARMAN
30-07-12, 07:49 PM
oh dear.. my only comfort is muz said lots.. not all :)

Shonky
30-07-12, 08:22 PM
I am a real armchair mechanic. Does that help?

rx213b
30-07-12, 09:22 PM
I'm here for the gangbang

Cordie
31-07-12, 12:54 AM
no gang bang sorry mate just a heap of tossers with there nickers in a knot, any of you legendary mechanics want to trade test me? And do you think I would spend the time developing a port and then post a video of it on the internet for every tosser to see? I don't know how else you would lower your deck height unless you started with a blank piston and drilled your own gudgeon pin hole? Any other areas you guys would like me to clear up? Would you rather next time I use a pair of stilsons to turn my cam? While I am at it can anyone here explain to me what a "ramp" is in a inlet port and how you could reduce turbulence and increase cfm with one?

Cordie
31-07-12, 12:55 AM
oh and so far 102.7 cfm at 600 thou lift :)

Cordie
31-07-12, 12:57 AM
Oh one more question for the smarty pants out there, what will improving the thermal efficiency of an engine improve and how could you achieve this improvement?

Skompa
31-07-12, 02:21 AM
Also in for the shitcunt mechanicness.

I can get a couple of free pulsars if you want to put a 4 banger in it.

Jim
31-07-12, 06:01 AM
wrap it in tinfoil or guacomale, its a well known trick to improving thermal efficiency of an engine improve.
HTH

BigMuz
31-07-12, 06:12 AM
Deck height is adjusted by indexing the crank, truing the deck and or mixing and matching rods. It is never ever adjusted by manually finishing a piston crown except by idiots.

Cfm is just a measure of how big a hole you hogged in that poor head. The velocity of airflow will be appalling and that engine will not even make stock horsepower.

millsi
31-07-12, 06:26 AM
Can TK please take time out and post here!!!

Shonky
31-07-12, 09:38 AM
Oh one more question for the smarty pants out there, what will improving the thermal efficiency of an engine improve and how could you achieve this improvement?
It will improve the thermal efficiency.

crack
31-07-12, 10:49 AM
Oh one more question for the smarty pants out there, what will improving the thermal efficiency of an engine improve and how could you achieve this improvement?

Thermal efficiency improvement is achieved by reducing energy lost to heat.

CA18escort
31-07-12, 02:01 PM
What you need to do is increase the brake mean effective pressure in the cylinder. Increasing thermal efficiency will aid in that regard but cannot replace stuffing more air into the engine.

jimmyg
31-07-12, 02:21 PM
AKA NOS or boost time. :yup:

Cordie
31-07-12, 03:11 PM
yes boost or nos is the sensible option but I am a stubborn mofo and will only use it if the budget will allow it and I dont get 80bhp na. I am not unaware of the epic goal I am trying to acheive with an F8B but the challange makes it worth my time. I have put of finishing my twin turbo 5.0l fairmont for powercruise in order to devote my time to this. Nothing ventured nothing gained, if anybody has had anything to do with the working of F8B motors for junior sprint cars I would appreciate any tips or hints.

Cordie
31-07-12, 03:12 PM
cheers

Cordie
31-07-12, 03:18 PM
Deck height is adjusted by indexing the crank, truing the deck and or mixing and matching rods. It is never ever adjusted by manually finishing a piston crown except by idiots.

Cfm is just a measure of how big a hole you hogged in that poor head. The velocity of airflow will be appalling and that engine will not even make stock horsepower.

Dont know who taught you to build engines but he must have been a narrow minded fucker, I measured and matched inconcistancys in rod length and crown height down to .003mm, I took .001m of one crown with 2000 grit and the window out of the workshop. Build a bridge and get over it mate. On the port front I made a big hole in one port on a fucked head I have so i could flow it and build it up with plasticene in order to see what port design worked best, I have gained 32 cfm from standard. Dont know how you flow heads buddy but if you have a better way feel free to fill me in.

Cordie
31-07-12, 03:22 PM
that wont make the power with a turbo either unless he o'rings the intake ports as well. id doubt a gasket would seal with that little meat left.

+4 mechanics in thread.

If only there was some way i could plate up the water jackets with some kind of welder that welds aluminium to aluminium? Oh wait thats right my tig can do that. Fuck of dickhead dont post on here unless you wish to value add

Cordie
31-07-12, 03:25 PM
I'm not sure what your point is cordie - on the one hand you're telling us that the whole thing is crap, the radius on the turns shocking, the ports are tiny and the mechanicals of the valvetrain are pathetic, but on the other hand you're blindly telling us it will make good power and run awesome times. You say " Putting it together for $1200 and achieving the power I am chasing is to most dim wits a pipe dream." even though there are about 10 people in this thread with the mechanical knowledge to know that this is, in fact, a pipe dream of yours. not to mention the mathematics behind the power and times you're trying to run is way off..... it's kinda weird watching you do this because none of it makes any sense? Do you have some type of psychological condition that we don't know about? Cause I don't wanna make fun of someone with "issues"

How do they "KNOW' if they have not tried? How much did you get at the wheels out of your F8B?

Cordie
31-07-12, 03:26 PM
This thread is a riot :)

Out of interest I went googling.

http://www.suzukituning.com/SuzukiTuning/AltoTuning/SuzukiAltoTuning.htm

Cheers buddy now I wont have to fuck around working out what plugs to run

Cordie
31-07-12, 03:28 PM
It's not roger either.

That won't make 80 horsepower at the wheels without a turbo. Those ports are shit and it would need to be double it's capacity or double the rpm for them to help at all.

Lots of qualified mechanics are retards so I wouldn't brag about that so much.

Not me mate just a bloke tying to acheive somthing considered unacheivable

Race Spec
31-07-12, 03:39 PM
Lay off the crack pipe mate and take heed in what 99% of people are saying. A challenge is one thing but your goals are completely and utterly unattainable! The only way possible this thing is going to travel 400 metres in 13 seconds is if you drive it off a cliff.

BigMuz
31-07-12, 04:03 PM
The funny thing is that we actually like this sort of shit here. If you said you were chasing 14.999 this would be an interesting quest. The combined knowledge here outdoes Mr Anderson's knowledge and you are ignoring it and being an idiot about it.

lysdexia
31-07-12, 04:28 PM
What muz says is bang on. this is a cool little project, you're just being massively unrealistic about what it takes to run a 13, and your attitude toward everyone else is fucked.

fat910
31-07-12, 04:35 PM
I think you've hit your head on the flow bench a few too many times buddy.

Jim
31-07-12, 06:20 PM
look, I think you either need to finish it and then tell us how you went, or take the offered advice with a smile and a thank you even if you choose not to follow it. Right now you just look like a dope.

ALLMTR
31-07-12, 06:23 PM
Can you tell me what the port to bore ratio is?

Gammaboy
31-07-12, 06:40 PM
The more Port you drink, the more you Bore your mates?

Cordie
31-07-12, 06:42 PM
fucks me I would have to cc the finished port

Cordie
31-07-12, 06:53 PM
Has anyone commenting on this forum actually had any experience with F8B powerups? I love this bigmuz fella telling me that decking a piston is the incorrect way to achieve the correct deck height. Here is one for ya muzza rebuilding a 4D56-t and the new pistons are protruding 27 tho I need 15 thou, should i knock the tops off on the lathe or .......?

Cordie
31-07-12, 07:09 PM
the last mechanic that rebuilt it couldn't work out why it kept blowing the crank seals so he knocked the fins of the turbine wheel with what looks like a bench grinder. This bloke is pushing 50 and been in the game for a long time. I guess it goes to show that it don't matter how long you have been in the game if your a simple fuck.......

MRMOPARMAN
31-07-12, 07:34 PM
If only there was some way i could plate up the water jackets with some kind of welder that welds aluminium to aluminium? Oh wait thats right my tig can do that. Fuck of dickhead dont post on here unless you wish to value add

so you can tig, but you cant read.. goes to show how fucked up primary schools are these days. have another look and try to work out what i was saying champ.

Jim
31-07-12, 07:36 PM
yeah a bit cunty

Billzilla
31-07-12, 07:40 PM
Let him do his engine guys - He's doing it all hands-on and that's more than the majority here do.
If it doesn't work then help him figure out why.

BigMuz
31-07-12, 08:00 PM
Has anyone commenting on this forum actually had any experience with F8B powerups? I love this bigmuz fella telling me that decking a piston is the incorrect way to achieve the correct deck height. Here is one for ya muzza rebuilding a 4D56-t and the new pistons are protruding 27 tho I need 15 thou, should i knock the tops off on the lathe or .......?

Why are they wrong?

Turning off a squish band is the worst possible way to fix it. Second worst is a thicker head gasket.

Getting a crank that swings right is best. Measuring it accurately before buying pistons and getting the block machined is the real answer.

Cordie
31-07-12, 08:14 PM
so you can tig, but you cant read.. goes to show how fucked up primary schools are these days. have another look and try to work out what i was saying champ.

don't assume bucko, you want to give a bloke some advice then give him some advice.

I posted a vehicle in the 13 sec for $1300 because I had a suzuki hatch sitting in my yard that I had started doing up as a p plate legal rocket. I don't care if it runs a 15 I would like to run a 14 NA but probably wont, I am keeping it NA and that's final.

I was curios to see what these ET calculators would come up with one told me I would do a 12 one told me I would do a 16 and few came up somewhere in between. Until somebody gets on here who has run a 600kg car down the strip in 13 sec and tells me what it took I am just winging it.

End of the day its my car, my money and my expertise that will be going into this car and if i don't know something I will ask somebody who does. 80bhp would be awesome but I will likely get 70bhp and from what I have worked out from asking people who know that will get me a 15. 15 second N/A hatch 800 = awesome.

I learn something new everyday, nobody on this thread has taught me anything bar the bloke who posted the link to a bloke who knew what plugs worked best.

Cordie
31-07-12, 08:17 PM
oh and jim, thanks jim

Cordie
31-07-12, 08:28 PM
Why are they wrong?

Turning off a squish band is the worst possible way to fix it. Second worst is a thicker head gasket.

Getting a crank that swings right is best. Measuring it accurately before buying pistons and getting the block machined is the real answer.

sure in a perfect world there would be no issue with excessive deck height but sadly some poor lady bought this car thinking it had been immaculately maintained and is now the owner of a lemon, the block has been decked and had a fair old haircut to get it true. The pistons will be going on the lathe and milled down, working with what we have and saving the lady some money.

CA18escort
31-07-12, 08:44 PM
Not exactly the same but the Mighty Boy with a G10A with cam extractors and putting down 29kw atw will do a 11.3 1/8 mile so around 16.5-17 sec 1/4. Worth bearing in mind that this engine standard has 38kw at the flywheel and it probably at around 45kw with the mods.

Love the fact that you are giving it a go but even 60kw at the engine which you are hoping for will be a stretch given that I have an extra 200cc to play with and a much newer motor.

If you can work out a way to get it to rev, and I am talking 9000+ then you might get enough power under the curve to get you into the 15's but it will be a big ask.

Regards
Paul

ALLMTR
31-07-12, 08:45 PM
Until somebody gets on here who has run a 600kg car down the strip in 13 sec and tells me what it took I am just winging it.



My 700kg car needed 135whp to run 13.9 at 98mph. It had torque that your 800cc NA motor could only dream to make.

Gammaboy
31-07-12, 09:36 PM
It takes 100 HP to drag 300kg of bike and rider down the quarter in 12.5ish at 120mph. Extrapolate from that what you will

Cordie
31-07-12, 09:52 PM
not much help, my 1/4 mile experience consists of turning up at willow bank with my old bosses twin turbo LS1 33 GTS-t and it needing to be launched from 3rd on 295 slicks to keep wheel spin moderate.

Very inconsistent but fun to watch none the less.

Cordie
31-07-12, 10:05 PM
8500 rpm if the distributor will let it on E85/alcohol with quad carby's, hoping to have enough left for ceramic tops on my pistons at 60 bucks a pot. I am going to then work from the gearbox back and make sure everything is micky mouse, one tight bearing and its not going to do shit. From what I have been able to extract from the speedway nuts is they cut down a head of the 4cyl 1.3 seiaras to up their cfm and make around 98bhp but they don't have much in the way of a drive line. I am also going to fit a air ram at the base of my windshield and with any luck it will help the cause. custom headers, port and cc matched everything and a very well set up valve train and cam to suit the motor.

And if it makes it off the dyno and to the strip I guess we wont be wondering what it will do any more.

Cordie
31-07-12, 10:07 PM
It takes 100 HP to drag 300kg of bike and rider down the quarter in 12.5ish at 120mph. Extrapolate from that what you will

bike and rider or 300kg bike plus rider?

Cordie
31-07-12, 10:08 PM
What muz says is bang on. this is a cool little project, you're just being massively unrealistic about what it takes to run a 13, and your attitude toward everyone else is fucked.

my attitude is fucked because they way people go about posting on this thread

Fondles
31-07-12, 10:11 PM
I measured and matched inconcistancys in rod length and crown height down to .003mm, I took .001m of one crown with 2000 grit and the window out of the workshop.

What did you use to measure with ?

Karnage
31-07-12, 10:13 PM
*edit* Fuckit, carry on and prove us wrong.....Obviously none of us have a clue, when you're done head down to any/every group 1 drag racer and teach them how to do their job, maybe when you're done there you can go and teach NASA a thing or two, clearly you have a superior understanding of physics.

Cordie
31-07-12, 10:16 PM
Not exactly the same but the Mighty Boy with a G10A with cam extractors and putting down 29kw atw will do a 11.3 1/8 mile so around 16.5-17 sec 1/4. Worth bearing in mind that this engine standard has 38kw at the flywheel and it probably at around 45kw with the mods.

Love the fact that you are giving it a go but even 60kw at the engine which you are hoping for will be a stretch given that I have an extra 200cc to play with and a much newer motor.



If you can work out a way to get it to rev, and I am talking 9000+ then you might get enough power under the curve to get you into the 15's but it will be a big ask.

Regards
Paul

is that the really neat white one with the roady carbs and custom headers?? did you do much with the valve train and cam? also did you up your comp ratio?

Cordie
31-07-12, 10:17 PM
What did you use to measure with ?

my dick

Fondles
31-07-12, 10:40 PM
my dick

You have your shit all up in a bunch due to "smart ass replies" and yet one asks a legit question you have to be the smart ass, go figure.

MRMOPARMAN
31-07-12, 10:56 PM
i REALLY wanna meet Mr. Anderson in person after reading this thread.

Tils
31-07-12, 11:11 PM
i REALLY wanna meet Mr. Anderson in person after reading this thread.

It wont be any good, you see, he can't impart any wisdom as he doesn't have a mouth...

http://psychsurvivor2.files.wordpress.com/2008/08/neo-mouth.jpg

CA18escort
01-08-12, 07:34 AM
is that the really neat white one with the roady carbs and custom headers?? did you do much with the valve train and cam? also did you up your comp ratio?

Those are Throttle bodies from a Truimph Daytona 675 and are not fitted yet, it is still running the carby. The cam is 222 duration at 0.350" lift so it is pretty mild. Headers are 32mm primary into 50mm collector with 28" primaries.

Compression is still standard at 9.5:1.

I am not sure that it is worth the effort but when I fit the ITBs I will probably lift the head skim it to up compression to 10.5:1 and unshroud the valves a bit and just give the ports a tidy up. Even then I am probably going to be lucky to get 55kw at the engine.

There is the option for a bigger cam but not sure that it is worth the effort. the funny thing is when you are starting with a 30kw starting point a 50% increase in power will only get you to 45kw.

Cheers
Paul

ls400x
01-08-12, 11:04 AM
How's this looking to complete a pass before the end of September?

BigMuz
01-08-12, 11:34 AM
He should grab a ticket to powercruise and go out and carve it up.

Guido
01-08-12, 12:55 PM
PF's most successful troll. Can't believe you guys are still getting so worked up about it.

Gammaboy
01-08-12, 01:33 PM
bike and rider or 300kg bike plus rider?

Did I fucking stutter?
300kg all up.

Cordie
01-08-12, 03:28 PM
Did I fucking stutter?
300kg all up.

skinny fucker i guess

Cordie
01-08-12, 03:29 PM
You have your shit all up in a bunch due to "smart ass replies" and yet one asks a legit question you have to be the smart ass, go figure.

dont ask stupid questions and you wont get a stupid answere

Cordie
01-08-12, 03:30 PM
How's this looking to complete a pass before the end of September?

well i hope to have it ready for dyno and testing by the end of the month

Gammaboy
01-08-12, 03:31 PM
skinny fucker i guess

Not particularly.

Billzilla
01-08-12, 04:35 PM
skinny fucker i guess

Not really.
My bike is about 110hp and just under 200 kg, I am just over 100 kg so the total would be much as Gammaboy says. I think they do high 11's though, not sure.

millsi
01-08-12, 08:32 PM
i have gone 11.0@125 with a bike and rider combined weight of 275kg and 100rwhp if thats of any help? stock 2001 gsxr600

noobd
01-08-12, 09:32 PM
I don't think this will work, but am happy to been proven wrong. Nitrous will help a lot.

Cordie
01-08-12, 10:17 PM
will put nos on it if budget allows but it will defeat the purpose of seeing what it can do N/A

ALLMTR
01-08-12, 10:18 PM
A top fuel engine only turns over about 540 turns from light to light

sideways
02-08-12, 12:10 AM
I can't speak for the 3 cyl variety, but it's quite well known that F8a and F10as will turn over 10'000 rpm. I would vouch for this but I don't currently have a tacho, it certainly feels like they do though.

To get real power(for an F motor) out of an F8b, fit an F6a head. DOHC, 4 valves per cylinder. Naturally, these were EFI and turbo but it's unlikely you'd be able to fit them in your budget. I don't know what it takes to fit the head, I assume it bolts on. You might have to fly cut the pistons and a few other things.

Keeping the EFI and Turbo (obviously), I have heard of Cappuccino guys getting 120hp out of this combo without going nuts on mods.

Just out of interest, what sort of revs is the hatch pulling at 100km/h? My LJ81(F8a) on standard size tyres pulls 5200 and my SJ40 Sierra (F10a) pulls 5000 on standard tyres. They'l both do it all day, but it is excruciating on long trips.

Thanks

Hayden

ALLMTR
02-08-12, 12:22 AM
BTW to cover 400m in 13.999 seconds, you need to AVERAGE 102.6kmh

tc josh
02-08-12, 09:56 AM
My old suzuki alto had a massaged F8 with a subaru liberty turbo strapped on the side converted to RWD, it was fun to drive but no where near a 13 second car.

also what do you use to measure to 1 micron, thats some decent measuring equipment right there

stockymcstock
02-08-12, 10:27 AM
Cappuccino guys

:rofl:

Gammaboy
02-08-12, 10:57 AM
My old suzuki alto had a massaged F8 with a subaru liberty turbo strapped on the side converted to RWD, it was fun to drive but no where near a 13 second car.

Sounds like an interesting toy. Details on rwd conversion?

tc josh
02-08-12, 11:12 AM
It was a jap import, pseudo AWD kei car. Came standard with 550cc turbo and AWD at the push of a button so already had tiny rear diff etc. We just removed the front drive shafts locked the rear:lol: and toyed with the engaging mechanism a bit and walla. Was waiting for it to bust a diff but never did surprisingly. Actually snapped the crank in the 550 after the libeerty turbo went on which is why it went up to the big block F8

Cordie
02-08-12, 09:18 PM
My old suzuki alto had a massaged F8 with a subaru liberty turbo strapped on the side converted to RWD, it was fun to drive but no where near a 13 second car.

also what do you use to measure to 1 micron, thats some decent measuring equipment right there

a micrometer, correct me if i am wrong but i think .001mm is 10 microns

Cordie
02-08-12, 09:20 PM
i REALLY wanna meet Mr. Anderson in person after reading this thread.

pop round to my workshop 92 Eatonvale Rd Tinana Qld

Cordie
02-08-12, 09:27 PM
*edit* Fuckit, carry on and prove us wrong.....Obviously none of us have a clue, when you're done head down to any/every group 1 drag racer and teach them how to do their job, maybe when you're done there you can go and teach NASA a thing or two, clearly you have a superior understanding of physics.

its performance engine building not rocket science, sadly I dont think an iq of 147 would qualify me to work for NASA

Cordie
02-08-12, 09:33 PM
Those are Throttle bodies from a Truimph Daytona 675 and are not fitted yet, it is still running the carby. The cam is 222 duration at 0.350" lift so it is pretty mild. Headers are 32mm primary into 50mm collector with 28" primaries.

Compression is still standard at 9.5:1.

I am not sure that it is worth the effort but when I fit the ITBs I will probably lift the head skim it to up compression to 10.5:1 and unshroud the valves a bit and just give the ports a tidy up. Even then I am probably going to be lucky to get 55kw at the engine.

There is the option for a bigger cam but not sure that it is worth the effort. the funny thing is when you are starting with a 30kw starting point a 50% increase in power will only get you to 45kw.

Cheers
Paul

I say do it, nothing ventured nothing gained

Cordie
02-08-12, 09:39 PM
I can't speak for the 3 cyl variety, but it's quite well known that F8a and F10as will turn over 10'000 rpm. I would vouch for this but I don't currently have a tacho, it certainly feels like they do though.

To get real power(for an F motor) out of an F8b, fit an F6a head. DOHC, 4 valves per cylinder. Naturally, these were EFI and turbo but it's unlikely you'd be able to fit them in your budget. I don't know what it takes to fit the head, I assume it bolts on. You might have to fly cut the pistons and a few other things.

Keeping the EFI and Turbo (obviously), I have heard of Cappuccino guys getting 120hp out of this combo without going nuts on mods.

Just out of interest, what sort of revs is the hatch pulling at 100km/h? My LJ81(F8a) on standard size tyres pulls 5200 and my SJ40 Sierra (F10a) pulls 5000 on standard tyres. They'l both do it all day, but it is excruciating on long trips.

Thanks

Hayden

very handy advice, I have been eyeing of a mightyboy to play with after I am bored with the hatch. I will be in touch :)

I am not sure on rpm at 100, i would have to look into it. The biggest issue will be getting around the points bouncing past 8000 rpm. there are a few 'secret squirrel' things i will have to pull out of the bag.

ALLMTR
02-08-12, 09:41 PM
Racing at Jambo?

BTW if you tag each post you wish to reply to (in the bottom right corner of each post) you can reply to everyone in the one post

Cordie
02-08-12, 09:46 PM
Racing at Jambo?

BTW if you tag each post you wish to reply to (in the bottom right corner of each post) you can reply to everyone in the one post

I would love to make it to jambo, I am sick of watching from the side and helping everyone else get their cars ready. Mb i could auto the hatch for bracket racing