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Thread: The next project - painting the shed floor

  1. #61
    Registered User PerformanceCar's Avatar
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    i had 3 layers of paint. 20yr old 'crete. Just diamond ground it to fresh concrete. thin down the first coat so it can penetrate and it'll be fine.
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  2. #62
    Problem? sssgtr's Avatar
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    Picked up 8L of Epotec 370 and a 1L tin of their R202 reducer (thinner) yesterday, going to be painting the floor this weekend.

    How much % wise should I thin the first coat out to? 10%? 20? more?

    Rinsing and degreasing first, then acid etching it with the White Knight concrete etch from bunnings.

    I'll take pics and put them up during each stage if anyone is interested?

  3. #63
    Bannered takai's Avatar
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    How much did that cost you?
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  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cal View Post
    My floor is 70+ years old, so it has had a fair share of oil, grease and all manner of other shit spilled on it over the decades. Perhaps it will just be too hard to get clean enough for this?
    cal, acid etch it, and go straight over the top


    for a DIY garage it will be fine. my garage was the same.

    I have a fuckload of acid too, i need to get rid of it, its yours for nothing.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by takai View Post
    How much did that cost you?
    $140 all up direct from Protec mate.

    Spent another $50-ish on brushes for cutting in the edges, disposable rollers, acid for etching, stiff bristle broom etc.

  6. #66
    Bannered takai's Avatar
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    Bloody hell thats cheap... i should do mine.
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  7. #67
    Moderator Cal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tim510 View Post
    cal, acid etch it, and go straight over the top


    for a DIY garage it will be fine. my garage was the same.

    I have a fuckload of acid too, i need to get rid of it, its yours for nothing.
    Reckon I'll take you up on that. Thanks mate.
    The most dangerous risk of all - the risk of spending your life not doing what you want, on the bet you can buy yourself the freedom to do it later. - Randy Komisar.

  8. #68
    Problem? sssgtr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by takai View Post
    Bloody hell thats cheap... i should do mine.
    They told me that their Epotec 370 doesn't like being applied in temps under 23 deg C, that was the only difference between their stuff and the $450 PPG equivalent.

  9. #69
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    All epoxy is temperature sensitive. Under 15 degrees floor or maybe 20 degrees air temp it pretty much stops curing.

    10 - 20% is usually the recommendation for the first coat on virgin concrete. More thinner if it is tight structure, less if it is coarse/open.

    PS lol @ white knight concrete etch. You just bought crystalline hydrochloric acid for about 5 times what it is worth!

  10. #70
    Problem? sssgtr's Avatar
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    Cheers muz. I'll thin it down 10% for the first coat.

    It's going to be 27-29 this weekend, but with periodic rain. Should be ok...

    Trust me, the white knight concrete etch didn't put a massive hole in my pocket! I think it was $12-15 from memory.

  11. #71
    Registered User New Stratos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sssgtr View Post
    Trust me, the white knight concrete etch didn't put a massive hole in my pocket!
    Obviously not strong enough then.

  12. #72
    Bannered takai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigmuz View Post
    All epoxy is temperature sensitive. Under 15 degrees floor or maybe 20 degrees air temp it pretty much stops curing.

    10 - 20% is usually the recommendation for the first coat on virgin concrete. More thinner if it is tight structure, less if it is coarse/open.

    PS lol @ white knight concrete etch. You just bought crystalline hydrochloric acid for about 5 times what it is worth!
    Where else to get crystalline HCl then, last time i went looking the White Knight stuff was the only stuff i could get, everything else needed a licence.
    Chris
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  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigmuz View Post
    All epoxy is temperature sensitive. Under 15 degrees floor or maybe 20 degrees air temp it pretty much stops curing.

    10 - 20% is usually the recommendation for the first coat on virgin concrete. More thinner if it is tight structure, less if it is coarse/open.

    PS lol @ white knight concrete etch. You just bought crystalline hydrochloric acid for about 5 times what it is worth!
    It's not Hydrochloric acid, as HCL doesn't crystallise at high concentrations instead it's a gas. The White Knight stuff is some other left-field organic acid that in the right concentration etches concrete.

    Chris you can buy 31% Hydrochloric acid at hardware stores and pool shops. It needs to be diluted down to ~10% before use (remember add acid to the water, not water to the acid!). It's also called Muriatic Acid.

    The " Concrete etching" link on this pages gives a good overview. http://www.solverpaints.com.au/pages/tips.html
    Yes we Chemistry

  14. #74
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    I used a watering can for acid application... gave me good distribution... once it was down I used a stiff broom to scrub the concrete...

    Make sure the area is well ventilated though!


    The difference between etched and non-etched was pretty noticeable.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by lumpy View Post
    It's not Hydrochloric acid, as HCL doesn't crystallise at high concentrations instead it's a gas. The White Knight stuff is some other left-field organic acid that in the right concentration etches concrete.

    Chris you can buy 31% Hydrochloric acid at hardware stores and pool shops. It needs to be diluted down to ~10% before use (remember add acid to the water, not water to the acid!). It's also called Muriatic Acid.

    The " Concrete etching" link on this pages gives a good overview. http://www.solverpaints.com.au/pages/tips.html
    Ahh of course Muriatic Acid.
    I cant remember actually whether i couldnt get it because i couldnt find any at all, or merely if i just wanted higher concentrations.
    Chris
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  16. #76
    Chopped BigMuz's Avatar
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    Yeah I shoulda googled that before posting!

  17. #77
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    White Knight Concrete Etch = Fail, do not even bother looking at this shit, it does not work. 40sqm to a 1kg container is bullshit.

    Hydrochloric acid = Win

    Etched the fucking floor twice on Friday, have left to dry until tomorrow morning since the slab got real wet. Ended up using 7 parts water to 1 part acid.

    Got rid of as much concrete dust as possible, but after painting inside the house, I could not be fucked sweeping anymore so I pinched my old man's leaf blower to get the rest out before the first coat goes down. Vacuumed up around the edges before lunch today.

    First coat going on tomorrow morning with luck.

    It's still a little gritty, I think if I was to get it grit free, I'd be there forever. It seems pretty acceptable at the moment, and with a bit more of a sweep / go over with the leaf blower it'll be good.

    Going to thin out the first coat by 10% to start.

  18. #78
    Chopped BigMuz's Avatar
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    Pics?

  19. #79
    "The bitches, are wet" Sketchy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cal View Post
    Reckon I'll take you up on that. Thanks mate.
    I'll steal any that you dont use
    Quote Originally Posted by Dimi View Post
    80mm of penetration isn't bad, i wish i had that much.
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    Sometimes im too busy to take names.

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigmuz View Post
    Pics?
    Tomorrow mate.

    Did the second coat this arvo, came up pretty good.

  21. #81
    BLING BLING PLAYA's Avatar
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    I have some oil dropped on my shed slab, not heaps but enough, will acid clean it as much as I need it to so the paint will stick?
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    Quote Originally Posted by PLAYA View Post
    I have some oil dropped on my shed slab, not heaps but enough, will acid clean it as much as I need it to so the paint will stick?
    degrease it, scrub it, acid etch and paint...

    she'll be right.

  23. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by sketchypiMp View Post
    I'll steal any that you dont use
    i've got like 12 litres of acid in the garage...needs to be used up or dumped soon!

  24. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by PLAYA View Post
    I have some oil dropped on my shed slab, not heaps but enough, will acid clean it as much as I need it to so the paint will stick?
    Degrease it thoroughly, scrub it in then rinse with a high pressure washer.

    Repeat several times.

    If the water beads still, keep doing the above.

    Acid will only make the surface porous, it won't get rid of the oil itself.

  25. #85
    Moderator Cal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tim510 View Post
    i've got like 12 litres of acid in the garage...needs to be used up or dumped soon!
    I will make this a Xmas project. You going to be around?
    The most dangerous risk of all - the risk of spending your life not doing what you want, on the bet you can buy yourself the freedom to do it later. - Randy Komisar.

  26. #86
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    yep i'll be around

  27. #87
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    Friday morning, degreased and washed down.









    Saturday morning, after etching with hydrolic acid at 7 parts water / 1 part acid.







    Sunday afternoon, first coat down.





    Monday afternoon after 2nd coat.

    Bought another kit of the Epotec 370, one kit didn't look like it would do the job even though they advised it would do 2 coats at 40sqm. I've got enough left to make up another 6L which will come in handy for painting some other stuff in the garage.

    I probably should have filled all the cracks and little imperfections, but they will open up again later on so i'm not fussed. The main work areas are uncracked and coated with the paint.

    My advice:

    Degrease the shit out of the floor, try and get everything up out of the concrete if you can.

    Let it dry for 2 days if possible since you will get the slab saturated with a high pressure washer.

    Vacuum up all the concrete dust after etching / grinding, sweeping it out was a cunt.

    Thin out the first coat to let it soak into the slab.

    Don't be a tightass with the paint, don't overdo the first coat so it soaks in, use plenty for the second coat, it'll make your life much easier!

    Clean up is easy for buckets / painting trays, wait for the stuff to dry and peel it off in one piece.

  28. #88
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    7:1 is a pretty weak solution (assume you were using 31% HCl). Where did you get that ratio from?

    For anyone else thinking of doing it a good way to check the floor is dry enough to paint (and you don't have a moisture meter handy) is to tape a small piece of clear plastic sheet on it overnight. If there is condensation on the underside of the plastic the floor is still too wet.
    Yes we Chemistry

  29. #89
    Problem? sssgtr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lumpy View Post
    7:1 is a pretty weak solution (assume you were using 31% HCl). Where did you get that ratio from?

    For anyone else thinking of doing it a good way to check the floor is dry enough to paint (and you don't have a moisture meter handy) is to tape a small piece of clear plastic sheet on it overnight. If there is condensation on the underside of the plastic the floor is still too wet.
    Good tip lumpy. Wish I had of thought to do that.

    7:1 I got from somewhere in this thread, someone had suggested to them 5:1, instructions on acid bottle suggested 10:1, so it's worth going somewhere down the middle. It was convienent too since I filled the watering can with 7L of water, then 1 litre of acid to bring it up to 8L in a 9L watering can.

    It was just the 5L off the shelf Digger's brand HCL from Bunnings, so yeah, I assume 31%.

    BTW, yes, the garage does not look the biggest, it's a 6m x 6.5m attached, but on the other side (right of the single entry door in the back) is another 3m x 4m shed on a slab that I am going to take down and build an extra room for the garage that will house my mill / lathe etc.

  30. #90
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    Here is a few photos of my floor.

    Area was around 85/90 Sq/M's.

    I emptied the garage, pressure washed, re pressure washed. Degreased with Chemtech Gutsy Degreaser, then sugar soaped and rinse.

    Then did an acid etch. Was around 5:1. There was heaps of fumes, and wasn't pleasant, but it managed to get it all done and scrub the floor.

    Final sweep then paint. I let it cure for around 72 hrs, then parked the cars on carpet squares for around a month.

    Photos:





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