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Thread: AW11 Thread

  1. #31
    Sensei Cobra
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Purple View Post
    Some of you may remember it from the PF Nebo/Sunshine Coast hinterland cruise in 2001 - where Norbie's black Supra overheated and Ken's AX-GT wore a Pulsar, swore to fix the handling then after Kiahatsu's Dolomite sprint was able to keep up!
    Holy shit, I remember that, that is a long time ago! I got the worst sunburn on my head that day. The whole scalp was blistered.

    Always liked these little things.

  2. #32
    Registered User Mr Purple's Avatar
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    Progress has been a bit delayed on this thing due to the new stablemate:



    Dual driveways are the new awesome...

    No, I didn't park these here for the shot - this was the 86 run in/AW11 150,000km cruise. Montville/Palmwoods/Eudlo/Peachester/Maleny.

    Somewhat surprisingly, an AW11 on semis and decent suspension can keep up with an 86. Though you're working a lot harder to do so. The AW11 has a hell of a lot more grip.

    Otherwise just fixed up the interior a little bit with a Momo mod08 and some replica OEM floor mats. Ricing.



    Brake pads/discs/braided lines and a few more bushings are on the way. Then a bit of a cosmetic tidy up before looking at the engine.

  3. #33
    Registered User Mr Purple's Avatar
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    So I've finished the suspension and brakes on this thing and am beginning to scratch my head on the mechanical side of things.

    Although I'm tempted to order a short 9AGTE setup from MRP it's probably overkill and I have two other project cars to finish first.

    I know the ITB conversion is almost retro now, and doesn't really add much over a well setup stock intake but I want to make 'vroom' noises more than actually go quickly anyway (which is probably why I also have an 86).

    So from what I gather I need:
    - 20V silvertop ITBs (which I conveniently have had sitting in a box for a while...).
    - Throttle body adaptor (TTT is the only easily available option I think, $295).
    - Trumpets and filter of some description. I don't want socks so thinking either ITG on backing plate or a custom plenum.

    Now because my middle name is 'overkill' and the 27yo ECU is now throwing up random faults I'm thinking a Haltech of some description. Given I know nothing about engine management (I can sort of understand how a weber works) what else do I need to start accumulating?
    - I'll be buying new and have no need for flex fuel support so which basic Haltech would be best?
    - TPS or MAP?
    - What else do I need?

    While this is happening the head will come off for some work and some decent cams, Bills' webpage may be written in circa 1995 HTML but contains much useful information. Given this thing is hardly a daily driver I'm thinking 288 degree cams, just a basic cleanup of the head as the big ports are a bit too big anyway, and shave for an actual decent compression ratio. Anyone recommend anyone to do this up this way? TK is the default answer but it seems like overkill given I'd be happy with anything over 150hp out of this setup. I'll leave the bottom end alone for now I think, MRP stroker kit and quaife LSD will appear some time in the future with any luck.

    Would appreciate any thoughts. Working around the corner from Cleveland Exhaust and someone there appears to own an AW11 so that's probably the simplest answer!

  4. #34
    Little engine that could. itsnotagsr's Avatar
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    Gze!
    "If you can make black marks on a straight from the time you turn out of a corner until the braking point of the next turn, then you have enough horsepower." - Mark Donahue Penske Porsche 917

    "In Japan we no give fark for Subaru" - Trust Japan Technical Director
    (TM - AVENGE)

    "You can never have enough power. I remember when we had Group B cars... THEN we had enough power!"
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  5. #35
    Registered User trdee's Avatar
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    WTF i swear there are almost more adub owners here than on toymods lol.

    I will have a detailed response to your questions later today.

  6. #36
    Two years in Lompoc... Lobster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trdee View Post
    WTF i swear there are almost more adub owners here than on toymods lol.

    I will have a detailed response to your questions later today.
    I think all the adub owners are still waiting for their toymods forum membership to be approved...
    Previously known as Lobster, Chuss's brother's anus, Chuss's brother, Lobsook, Lobstersock, Socks, Sockz, MissAmericaImportGirl, ClutchCLobster

    CJM 4 Life yo!

  7. #37
    Registered User trdee's Avatar
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    lol i just checked and we'e got 197 outstanding forum applications atm. each account needs to be manually approved by a board member and we don't have infinite time to keep doing it every single day, so deal with it :P i just pumped out 10 now

  8. #38
    Registered User I'm DJ!'s Avatar
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    One of these is on my list soon. So cool, great thread, keep us updated.
    DJ's don't need sigs

  9. #39
    Registered User trdee's Avatar
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    Answers in bold

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Purple View Post
    So I've finished the suspension and brakes on this thing and am beginning to scratch my head on the mechanical side of things.

    Although I'm tempted to order a short 9AGTE setup from MRP it's probably overkill and I have two other project cars to finish first.
    To do it right will cost you 12-15k, so it isn't a job to take on lightly

    I know the ITB conversion is almost retro now, and doesn't really add much over a well setup stock intake but I want to make 'vroom' noises more than actually go quickly anyway (which is probably why I also have an 86).
    ITBs do unlock more power on a 16v (with the right mods), and the sound alone is worth the effort anyway. Do it

    So from what I gather I need:
    - 20V silvertop ITBs (which I conveniently have had sitting in a box for a while...). Yes
    - Throttle body adaptor (TTT is the only easily available option I think, $295). Detailed walkthrough here: http://www.toymods.org.au/forums/thr...16v?highlight=
    - Trumpets and filter of some description. I don't want socks so thinking either ITG on backing plate or a custom plenum. 110mm trumpets seem to be the ideal length but I don't think they will fit in an adub engine bay. DO NOT get uni filters. They flow like arse. Pipercross or ITG only. You could go an MRP plenum but then you wont enjoy the awesome noise of open trumpets.

    Now because my middle name is 'overkill' and the 27yo ECU is now throwing up random faults I'm thinking a Haltech of some description. Given I know nothing about engine management (I can sort of understand how a weber works) what else do I need to start accumulating?
    - I'll be buying new and have no need for flex fuel support so which basic Haltech would be best? Sport 500 or 1000. I am partial to adaptronics though and would recommend the 440 select
    - TPS or MAP? MAP tuning wont work properly especially if you get big cams. You need to tune by TPS vs RPM. It's a bit of a cunt but still easy enough to do if you know what you're doing. I had my car up and driving the same day I finished wiring the ecu in.
    - What else do I need? read the detailed walkthrough I listed above

    While this is happening the head will come off for some work and some decent cams, Bills' webpage may be written in circa 1995 HTML but contains much useful information. Given this thing is hardly a daily driver I'm thinking 288 degree cams, just a basic cleanup of the head as the big ports are a bit too big anyway, and shave for an actual decent compression ratio. Anyone recommend anyone to do this up this way? TK is the default answer but it seems like overkill given I'd be happy with anything over 150hp out of this setup. I'll leave the bottom end alone for now I think, MRP stroker kit and quaife LSD will appear some time in the future with any luck.

    With just cams you might get into the high 80/low 90kw range. If you're going to do this, it isn't much more of a step to pull the bottom end apart, get some high comp pistons and an uprated oil pump and really make the motor dance.

    With 12.5:1 (assuming you want to stay on petrol, go 14.5:1 if E85) compression and those cams you ought to get into the 100kw+ range.

    The above compression plus head work, prepped bottom end and some 300ish degree cams will get you into the 120-130kw range revving it to 9k+. That's roughly as far as you will get without spending cubic dollars on dry sumps and strokers and 10k+rpm

    **with any of the above setups, you will need to tap the head and run an external oil drain, as extended high rpm will cause oil to pool in the head on the bigports**


    Would appreciate any thoughts. Working around the corner from Cleveland Exhaust and someone there appears to own an AW11 so that's probably the simplest answer!
    Last edited by trdee; 28-03-15 at 12:01 AM.

  10. #40
    Registered User Mr Purple's Avatar
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    Thanks for that!

    I'm on Toymods as well, and was on twincam16 before that! Just prefer to steer clear of one make places if I can, they get a bit 'odd'.

    Thinking a compression ratio on the lower side, running 98, as it's hard to get E85 down my way. Time to start collecting bits I think...

  11. #41
    Registered User trdee's Avatar
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    I know what you mean. Either way, have a read of that writeup as it has all the info you need regarding the 20v ITB install.

    On 98 you can safely run 12.5:1 comp. Some 288s or thereabouts and some mild port work + silvertop throttles got one of my mates to make just over 100rwkw in his bigport 4A powered TA22

  12. #42
    anyone? MRMOPARMAN's Avatar
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    AW11's dont really get rid of engine bay heat that well, so imo, forget about filtering each ITB, get a plenum and make a cold air intake for it. it would also help somewhat to either get a GZE bonnet, or cut the bracing of yours away, GZE stylez.

    ecu wise, 4a's are pretty basic machines, any ECU with as much power as a calculator will be able to run one, so a basic haltech/adaptronic/vipec/link will do everything you need and more. have a talk to your preferred tuna about what he likes to use, then go with that.

    cams and itbs will give you some power of course, but you will be limited by an average head, and pathetic compression. heads are easy to do, so you could get a spare one tickled by TK etc and just swap over when your ready.
    for cheap compression, use 20v pistons/bottom ends. keep in mind that your motor will become an interference motor if you do this.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rdyno
    70ynu has to be the most retarded cunt here. "Help me please" me "you need to remove your head" him "fuck off cunt I'm to lazy fuck off out of my thread you told me to do something I don't want to do so you're a cunt fuck off can some one please tell me an easier way???"
    Quote Originally Posted by Tripper
    Its a tight battle between you and rogercordia for the most retarded member on here, thou i think you have it by 5 window licks

  13. #43
    Registered User Bren's Avatar
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    For trumpets and filters for the 20v throttles have a look at what Sam Qu has from his shop SQ Engineering. He was also developing an adaptor that will be better than the TTT one, but that has been put on hold. Not sure how long for. Sprint 500 will be good, I hopefully will be picking up a Motec M4 for mine in the next couple of months. If you can find one cheap they do a good job with 16v. Heaps of optionss

  14. #44
    This space left blank Ben Wilson's Avatar
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    If you want decent compression and TBs, why not just go a 20v conversion?

    My silvertop was OK, I'd think a blacktop would be a better thing though...
    Imagination is more important than knowledge.

  15. #45
    Registered User trdee's Avatar
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    Blacktop's are a good thing. But if rebuilding they are more expensive/more of a pain in the arse to get bits. You can get some pistons and cams for the 16v pretty cheap and then be making more power than a stock BT anyway...

  16. #46
    Registered User Mr Purple's Avatar
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    Thanks! Yes, the blacktop 20V conversion would probably be a simpler and cheaper option in the end but I'm keen to keep the 16V anyway. I've owned the car for over half its life now and it seems wrong to convert it!

    I had a look at Sam Q's webpage on the weekend and it looks like he does a decent backplate for a pipercross filter, would be handy if he comes up with a TB adaptor as well, the prototype diagrams look decent. Sprint 500 looks like it will do everything needed and is reasonably cheap.

  17. #47
    Registered User trdee's Avatar
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    also, the noise of open trumpets is worth losing a few kw in hot engine bay air. don't listen to these guys telling you go make up an airbox and cold air intake! :P

  18. #48
    anyone? MRMOPARMAN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trdee View Post
    also, the noise of open trumpets is worth losing a few kw in hot engine bay air. don't listen to these guys telling you go make up an airbox and cold air intake! :P
    i hope thats obvious italics?
    Quote Originally Posted by Rdyno
    70ynu has to be the most retarded cunt here. "Help me please" me "you need to remove your head" him "fuck off cunt I'm to lazy fuck off out of my thread you told me to do something I don't want to do so you're a cunt fuck off can some one please tell me an easier way???"
    Quote Originally Posted by Tripper
    Its a tight battle between you and rogercordia for the most retarded member on here, thou i think you have it by 5 window licks

  19. #49
    Registered User dnegative's Avatar
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    Eh, threw a ITG air filter on mine so I dont dust the cunt.
    Sounds the same, made 93krwk sucking filthy hot air so there is easily more in getting something air not off the block/exhaust into the motor.

    I'm just waiting for someone to make/sell a snorkel that doesnt look shit or cost $500 before making a basic cold air feed.
    Quote Originally Posted by cracka View Post
    Fuck I'm retarded

  20. #50
    anyone? MRMOPARMAN's Avatar
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    cant route a cold air intake to the engine bay vent on the rh? side of the car?
    Quote Originally Posted by Rdyno
    70ynu has to be the most retarded cunt here. "Help me please" me "you need to remove your head" him "fuck off cunt I'm to lazy fuck off out of my thread you told me to do something I don't want to do so you're a cunt fuck off can some one please tell me an easier way???"
    Quote Originally Posted by Tripper
    Its a tight battle between you and rogercordia for the most retarded member on here, thou i think you have it by 5 window licks

  21. #51
    Registered User Bren's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bueller View Post
    i hope thats obvious italics?
    It's more than likely not italics. 4AGE's with open ITB's sound brilliant! And having an airbox might give you an extra what? 3 or 4kw? Realistically, you won't really notice that anyway. And even if you would, the setup old mate suggested with open TB's will still make more power than the car has now, so who cares?

  22. #52
    Registered User trdee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bueller View Post
    cant route a cold air intake to the engine bay vent on the rh? side of the car?
    my turbo setup does exactly that:



    HUEHUEHUE


    Le silvertop is a stopgap motor till the turbo engine is done and i literally dont give a fuck how much power it makes. The ONLY reason I fitted trumpets is because it sounds awesome, lol. Still made 86kw which is a solid effort for a tired old silvertop. Cold air intake might have given me an extra 4-5kw at the very best. I could have kept the factory silvertop airbox which was routed into the factory AW11 boot-mounted induction piping if I wanted a CAI. But fuqdat losing the epic induction to make an irrelevant difference to power. It will be slow either way, so it may as well sound good
    Last edited by trdee; 30-03-15 at 10:34 PM.

  23. #53
    Registered User Mr Purple's Avatar
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    Ducting could get complicated with a plenum, either out the right intake vent, through the boot like the stock location or through a vented engine lid. Open ITBs are worth it more for noise 'vrooms' rather than actual engine 'vrooms', if it annoys me I can always fit a plenum later.

    Made the mistake of going through Takai's build thread with 4AGE by TK. Never do this. So much shiny...

  24. #54
    Registered User Bren's Avatar
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    Haha, yeah I went through that thread as well. Big mistake! A lot of dollars, but it makes great power! If you got a similar head down with the 9A bottom end you would be winning at 4AGE life!

  25. #55
    Registered User Bren's Avatar
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    Another 9A alternative, which is made/developed here is Australia, is from Chris Barry at Speed Racer Sports Cars - www.speedracersportscars.com
    He builds them for PRB guys who compete in the PRB race series. 1900cc, and around 240hp. He is actually currently selling a PRB race car with a 250+hp 1950cc 16v. Definitely worth a look when you are interested in doing the stroker. Email is info@speedracersportscars.com

  26. #56
    Registered User Mr Purple's Avatar
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    Good to see there's a local guy doing it as well. The more I think about it the more a 1.8-1.9 stroker seems like the best option, 10,000rpm probably won't get much of a use in town!

    Unfortunately if it goes that way I think I'll have to finish my other two projects first, so much for just doing the head, ECU and ITBs. Will keep the thread going!

  27. #57
    Registered User Bren's Avatar
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    Yeah, 8000rpm with extra torque from stroker will be awesome for street duties. 10,000rpm is really just for bragging rights
    Last edited by Bren; 31-03-15 at 11:11 PM.

  28. #58
    anyone? MRMOPARMAN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bren View Post
    It's more than likely not italics. 4AGE's with open ITB's sound brilliant! And having an airbox might give you an extra what? 3 or 4kw? Realistically, you won't really notice that anyway. And even if you would, the setup old mate suggested with open TB's will still make more power than the car has now, so who cares?
    depends. chuck a quick stop (eg fuel) or start stop traffic etc, get a bit of heatsoak through the engine bay and you will be feeling it alot more. and more noticeable again coz theres fuck all fresh clean air since the motor is at the back of the car.

    might only gain 4kw but once you get some heat soak it will feel a bit more than that! trdee has the right idea.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rdyno
    70ynu has to be the most retarded cunt here. "Help me please" me "you need to remove your head" him "fuck off cunt I'm to lazy fuck off out of my thread you told me to do something I don't want to do so you're a cunt fuck off can some one please tell me an easier way???"
    Quote Originally Posted by Tripper
    Its a tight battle between you and rogercordia for the most retarded member on here, thou i think you have it by 5 window licks

  29. #59
    Registered User Mr Purple's Avatar
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    Can't believe this has gone by another couple of years with no updates!

    Probably because unlike my other cars, nothing has really gone wrong. Have fixed an annoying thud from the front end by replacing the Whiteline swaybar mounts with some rose jointed ones from Twosrus and the engine light still intermittently comes on and off, but these things are just stupidly reliable.

    I'm still contemplating more power as a 30th birthday present for this thing. Old Cleveland Road is driving me mental with 88kW. The problem is I've also realised that 200hp in an only slightly heavier 86 is still slow, so an unhinged NA 4AGE probably isn't the answer.

    With that in mind the new plan is a fairly conservative turbo 4AGE. The big problem I can find is that as far as I can work out the only gearbox of choice is an E51, which are slightly rarer than hen's teeth.

    With that in mind I think I'll start sorting out the gearbox now. The current plan is:
    - Mystery condition E51 sourced from Yahoo Japan ($300-500).
    - Double that cost with shipping.
    - Complete rebuild by Road and Track at Ipswich with Quaife LSD ($1100 for the diff alone).

    Overcapitalising on old shitboxes v3. I'm thinking the gearbox might almost be the most expensive part of this decision.

    In terms of the motor my thoughts were to keep it simple - MRP single throttle plenum and AW11 turbo manifold, Haltech with flex fuel and high(ish) 9.5 CR forged pistons with billet rods. My plan was not to go in with a target power output, but build it properly and once only. It'll still probably have 300hp+ at the fly in the end.

    The big question is whether to rebuild the current engine locally and keep it 16 valve/1.6l, or get Barry at MRP to just put together a fairly simple 20V headed turbo build, possibly with a 7AGE bottom end. Either way I'm thinking $7-10k budget for the engine, getting around $3-4k for the box plus ancillaries, so it's at this stage I start slowly accumulating parts and stop adding things up.

    On the positive side it is immaculate and rust free so I don't have to start with a bare metal respray like I usually do.

    Any critiques or thoughts on turbo selection are welcome!

  30. #60
    . crack's Avatar
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    definitely decide on a power figure as it helps with selecting everything from fuel pump and injectors, to turbo and intercooler, to exhaust manifold and plenum, to intake and exhaust pipe sizes and also ecu and sensor selection.

    200rwhp I'd just use a 2nd hand WRX turbo, stock gearbox, upgrade clutch, freshen up engine and budget ecu, pump and injectors. would be quite cheap and nearly double the power. more than that and probably time for an e-series box and a motor built for boost.

    e-series box has different 'engine mounts', half shafts, shifter cables, clutch, diff, etc. so the cost of the e-series conversion can go over $4k quite easily. for me the diff was $1500, g/box rebuild kit $1000, clutch $800ish, three new 'engine mount' rubbers $200ish, and the rest of the hardware i got out of a wrecked 4agze aw11.

    i see there are complete aw11 4agze drivelines on ebay for $3.6k plus delivery. that way you can use the stronger 4agze block too. i managed to find a complete 4agze aw11 lcoally for $900 but that is not the norm.

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