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Thread: Why is single exhaust runner glowing

  1. #1
    FJ20DEBT NISMOgemini's Avatar
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    4ze1 Why is single exhaust runner glowing

    I have a 4ze1 2.6l rodeo engine in one of my geminis and having an issue with just the rear exhaust runner glowing red. This happens at idle and while driving. Iv only driven it down the street and back as i wanted to see if it was just a issue from sitting stationary. I had a stock 4zd1 2.3l in the car previously with The same twin 40 downdrafts and the same exhaust manifold. So all the bolt ons are exactly as before with no changes. just the new head and block between. New block is rebuilt stock and the head is ported polished and cam added.

    Iv checked for vac leaks. Checked timing. Checked the plugs. All seems fine. Any ideas on what could be causing this and how to fix it.
    Other than the glow it seems to run fine. But i havnt been able to take it on a proper drive as yet due to this issue

    Cheers. Gene
    Last edited by NISMOgemini; 28-12-17 at 05:03 PM.

  2. #2
    FJ20DEBT NISMOgemini's Avatar
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    Picture here. This is after a few minutes of idle
    https://ibb.co/dZ1nPw
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  3. #3
    Look behind you... Milkman Don's Avatar
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    Why is single exhaust runner glowing

    Shit ay. What are the plugs telling you?

    Throw a leak tester on see if you got in unseated exhaust valve
    Last edited by Milkman Don; 28-12-17 at 11:40 AM.
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    I agree with Rdyno

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    Some dumb questions:
    How does it actually run/feel?
    Have you got plug leads wrong?
    Can you check the timing on cylinder 1 and 4 and make sure its the same?
    Then Comp test it?
    What does the plug look like?
    Swap no 4 spark plug into no 3.

  5. #5
    FJ20DEBT NISMOgemini's Avatar
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    Plugs all look the same after pulling then out to check
    Never done a leak test. Will Google and see if its something I can do here

  6. #6
    FJ20DEBT NISMOgemini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PITS View Post
    Some dumb questions:
    How does it actually run/feel?
    Have you got plug leads wrong?
    Can you check the timing on cylinder 1 and 4 and make sure its the same?
    Then Comp test it?
    What does the plug look like?
    Swap no 4 spark plug into no 3.
    It feels like it running mint. But as i mentioned only a short drive down the street.
    Leads are on the right plugs. Iv had them on and off a few times while checking everything.
    I checked the timing on 4 and melted the timing light lead. That how I actually found the issue. Will need to by a new one to check 1 against 4
    Ill do a compression test. Didnt think of doing that. Is that the same as the 'leak test' milkman don mentioned?
    Iv put brand new plugs in also with no change

  7. #7
    Compulsive modifier awdmoke's Avatar
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    I've had similar when a cam has gone "round" once the hard facing wore off.
    All valve gaps good?
    Lots of minis & mokes including a G13b powered Sports Sedan, a couple of Swift Gtis, a Goggomobil, Porsche 928S, Polo Gti, BMW 540i, a WRX and a few others.

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    Check intake valve cam lobe/lash and make sure it's good, then check intake runner for air leak around the fuel injector, check fuel injector after that. Let us know on the compression test, could be an unseated exhaust valve as mentioned.

    Basically either you've got super hot combustion going on, or it's not burning in the chamber but instead out in the exhaust runner.

  9. #9
    FJ20DEBT NISMOgemini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by awdmoke View Post
    I've had similar when a cam has gone "round" once the hard facing wore off.
    All valve gaps good?
    Yeah i checked valve gaps.
    Cam is relatively new and still looks fine

  10. #10
    FJ20DEBT NISMOgemini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xnke View Post
    Check intake valve cam lobe/lash and make sure it's good, then check intake runner for air leak around the fuel injector, check fuel injector after that. Let us know on the compression test, could be an unseated exhaust valve as mentioned.

    Basically either you've got super hot combustion going on, or it's not burning in the chamber but instead out in the exhaust runner.
    It's twin carby. Iv checked for vac leaks. Iv also sprayed all around the rear Webber and intake runners with start ya bastard to see if i could notice anything.

    Comp test was all good


    Engine temps are fine. Actually lower than expected. Which makes me think fuel in the exhaust? As the engine isnt heating up.
    Would retarded timing cause this? Iv just read online these are prone to the balancers slipping giving a faulty timing reading?

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    It's possible that the damper has slipped, best way is to check static timing by pulling a plug and setting TDC with a wire or something. You might only see it on the one cylinder because of the way the exhaust is bent there, catching heat in the corner and it's just that one is getting hot first.

    if the timing is retarded, I bet it starts easy and quick!

  12. #12
    FJ20DEBT NISMOgemini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xnke View Post
    It's possible that the damper has slipped, best way is to check static timing by pulling a plug and setting TDC with a wire or something. You might only see it on the one cylinder because of the way the exhaust is bent there, catching heat in the corner and it's just that one is getting hot first.

    if the timing is retarded, I bet it starts easy and quick!
    i was actually supprised how easy it does start. I'll check the balancer out. I Usually drop a screw driver in the spark plug holes.
    Would retarded push fuel into the runner?

  13. #13
    Gas Turbine enthusiast da9jeff's Avatar
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    A mate had the balancer slip on a red motor. Would set the timing all good, do a run and it would go back to shit.

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    You may need some of this.


  15. #15
    Registered User 9triton's Avatar
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    yes retarded timing can do this - spark too late -so its still burning as it exists the exhaust valve .

    but usually at 3000 rpm or so not at idle - unless its super retarded



    how it can do it on No 4 pipe and not no 1 has me baffled .
    check timing with ;ight on no 1 cyl and then again on No 4- should be same timing markes



    also a rich mixture (as wellas lean)- is the second carb that feeds No 4 float stuck down/sunk/needle valve stuck open ? etc ?
    Last edited by 9triton; 29-12-17 at 01:55 PM.

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    FJ20DEBT NISMOgemini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 9triton View Post
    yes retarded timing can do this - spark too late -so its still burning as it exists the exhaust valve .

    but usually at 3000 rpm or so not at idle - unless its super retarded



    how it can do it on No 4 pipe and not no 1 has me baffled .
    check timing with ;ight on no 1 cyl and then again on No 4- should be same timing markes



    also a rich mixture (as wellas lean)- is the second carb that feeds No 4 float stuck down/sunk/needle valve stuck open ? etc ?
    Checked timing 1 against 4.
    Number 4 is timed 12 before
    When I checked on number one it seems to be up 1 degree at around 13?


    Ill look into the sticky float

  17. #17
    Registered User 9triton's Avatar
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    1 deg difference is nothing to worry about

    BUT is the 12 deg correct? - ie timing mark on balancer correct.

    can check with piston stop:

    first google youtube hit :

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PD0ZRc7Dy28
    Last edited by 9triton; 29-12-17 at 05:05 PM.

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    "balancer slip" doesn't indicate the balancer has slipped on the crankshaft, it indicates that the outer ring of the balancer has slipped on the inner ring of the balancer, so now the timing mark does not mean shit when compared against the timing tab. They're normally bonded together by a rubber polymer that shrinks and cracks over time, and so the bond breaks and the outer ring starts walking.

    If you've slipped the balancer on the crank snout, then the crankshaft bolt has backed off, stretched, or something behind the crank pulley (slinger ring, crush washer, other washer) has released or reduced the clamp load on the balancer, and once that clamp load is off the key and keyway will absolutely not take the torque load of the balancer on a running engine.

  19. #19
    あなたの母親の肛門 Shifty's Avatar
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    Timing being massively off will make it run hot - eg. plug leads close enough to run ok but not quite

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    Quote Originally Posted by NISMOgemini View Post
    I have a 4ze1 2.6l rodeo engine in one of my geminis and having an issue with just the rear exhaust runner glowing red. This happens at idle and while driving. Iv only driven it down the street and back as i wanted to see if it was just a issue from sitting stationary. I had a stock 4zd1 2.3l in the car previously with The same twin 40 downdrafts and the same exhaust manifold. So all the bolt ons are exactly as before with no changes. just the new head and block between. New block is rebuilt stock and the head is ported polished and cam added.

    Iv checked for vac leaks. Checked timing. Checked the plugs. All seems fine. Any ideas on what could be causing this and how to fix it.
    Other than the glow it seems to run fine. But i havnt been able to take it on a proper drive as yet due to this issue

    Cheers. Gene
    Check the basics, compression and valve clearances.

  21. #21
    Chopped BigMuz's Avatar
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    Air leak on the exhaust with it running fairly rich overall would do that. Does it have an air pump still?
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    No air pump or injection in the photo, but hard to say if the header is leaking. Would have to be leaking at the header flange, though.

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    FJ20DEBT NISMOgemini's Avatar
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    I did notice a small noise around the 4th runner like and exhaust leak. It's either on the flang against the head or the connection between the extractors and start of the exhaust as they are fairly close and I cant tell exactly where its coming from.. I was planning to put new gaskets on. Didnt think it could have an effect like this. Will get them changed asap an see if there is any result.

  24. #24
    FJ20DEBT NISMOgemini's Avatar
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    Iv also checked the balancers and it dosnt look like its slipped. Marks on it and the crank look to line up fairly accurately

  25. #25
    Registered User ls400x's Avatar
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    Air leak on the inlet manifold at this cylinder making it run lean perhaps?

  26. #26
    Registered User JZK25's Avatar
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    Brake booster on number 4 runner and booster leaking?
    David Fraser - Automotive Historian!

    Quote Originally Posted by bigmuz View Post
    You can't polish a turd but you can put 600hp in it and laugh your fucking arse off coming past someone sideways at Powercruise.

  27. #27
    FJ20DEBT NISMOgemini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JZK25 View Post
    Brake booster on number 4 runner and booster leaking?
    some one else thought this but booster is on 3

  28. #28
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    i think you are more likely to have AFR off on a single cylinder than timing off on 1 cylinder. i would also think its a lean condition and the leak would need to be intake related to cause a slow/delayed burn
    Last edited by E30is; 01-01-18 at 08:50 AM.
    E30 325is M20 3.1L

  29. #29
    Registered User 9triton's Avatar
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    show us a pic of the inlet manifold and carbs :

    is it 2 x 2 barrel carbs? ''if

    if 2 barrels are they progressive -or synchronous?

    inlet manifold configured so 1 and 4 on carb and 2 and 3 on other

    or 1 +2 and other carb is 3+4?
    Last edited by 9triton; 01-01-18 at 12:57 PM.

  30. #30
    FJ20DEBT NISMOgemini's Avatar
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    Here are picks. Twin downdrafts.
    1 barrel per cylinder on its own runner
    https://ibb.co/dCc3Mb
    https://ibb.co/esSaZw

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